You will be driven from Afghanistan just as we were

[Menydh]

You will be driven from Afghanistan just as we were, Russian generals warn

The Sunday Telegraph
September 24, 2006

British troops will be forced to flee Afghanistan, say former Soviet commanders who oversaw Moscow's disastrous campaign against the mujahedeen in the 1980s.

In a withering assessment of the "hopeless" campaign being waged there, they have told The Sunday Telegraph that mounting casualties will drive out Britain and its Nato allies. Chillingly, Gen Ruslan Aushev, who was injured during fighting with mujahedeen rebels, predicted: "You will flee from there."

He added: "Many have fought in Afghanistan; first and foremost, the British fought there in the 19th century. The astonishing thing today is that Nato and the coalition seem to have learnt nothing, neither from their own experience nor from our experience."

The bleak analysis comes only days after Des Browne, the Defence Secretary, admitted that "the Taliban's tenacity has been a surprise", an acknowledgement of recent disclosures in this newspaper that troops are on the point of "exhaustion" because of the lack of numbers and equipment.

It will add to mounting concern over the deployment of 3,600 - British troops to Afghanistan's troubled southern provinces this summer, which has led to the deaths of 15 servicemen at the hands of a rejuvenated Taliban.

Yesterday, Gen Sir Richard Dannatt, the chief of the General Staff, was forced to deny claims by a senior officer that the RAF's performance in Afghanistan had been "utterly, utterly useless".

Responding to emails written by Major James Loden of 3 Para, he said: "This is difficult and dangerous work but we are doing it successfully because we are doing it as a team."

Numbers of wounded are far higher than has been made public, according to a major in the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers last week, a concern first revealed in The Sunday Telegraph. Gen Dannatt denied there was any deliberate cover-up.

It is a far cry from John Reid's declaration on a visit to Afghanistan as defence secretary in April that he would "be perfectly happy to leave in three years and without firing one shot".

Veterans of the former Soviet forces know all too well the risks and dangers facing British troops and their Nato counterparts.

Having invaded to support Kabul's pro-communist government in 1979, they soon found themselves fighting American-backed tribal mujahedeen at a cost of 15,000 Russian lives, despite brutal efforts to suppress the uprising.

The Soviet Union pulled out its 100,000-strong force a decade later, a demoralising defeat that was a factor in the eventual collapse of the communist regime.

Gen Boris Gromov, overall commander of Soviet forces in Afghanistan who supervised their withdrawal in 1989, said in written correspondence with The Sunday Telegraph that Britain, America and their Nato allies appeared to be suffering the same backlash.

Whatever their disagreements with Taliban militants or warlords in their midst, said Gen Gromov, Afghans tended to unite against outsiders when they deemed them no longer welcome. He said there had been a "large number of victims" on both sides, a possible reference to American airstrikes against suspected Taliban and al-Qaeda militants in which civilians are also reported to have died.

"The Afghan resistance is, in my opinion, growing," he wrote. "Such behaviour on the part of the intractable Afghans is to my mind understandable. It is conditioned by centuries of tradition… geography, climate and religion.

"We saw over a period of many years how the country was torn apart by civil war… But in the face of outside aggression, Afghans have always put aside their differences and united. Evidently, the coalition forces have also been seen as a threat to the nation."

The former Soviet commanders point out that they had enjoyed the advantages of a functioning and politically sympathetic domestic government in Kabul, and a 100,000 strong Afghan army on their side. Its equivalent today is a quarter of the size and still being trained by coalition forces.

"It was a 100,000 strong army with aviation, armoured vehicles and artillery," said Gen Aushev. "Their officers were trained in Moscow and they were more or less battle-ready. Now I just don't see the Afghan army."

Opium was a local crop, instead of the export industry that it has become. "Now opium is a major business and no one is going to get rid of that," added Col Oleg Kulakov, who served as a military translator during the Afghan war and is now Professor of Geopolitics at the Moscow Defence University. "Each warlord has his own stake in it; sometime his power is completely based on drugs."

He added: "The only thing in the West's favour is that you have allies, while we were isolated."

Gen Aushev believed that the Americans, who have 18,000 troops in Afghanistan, were attempting to pave the way for a quiet exit by asking for more soldiers from allies such as Britain and Poland.

"The Americans can't have another Vietnam, so they are saving face. They will say, 'We did not withdraw; it was the Australians, the British who withdrew'."


[source]

[Exeter]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,1883784,00.html

I think the former Soviet commanders are right. It is not the first time the British military have tried to mess up Afghanistan. They did so in the 19th century as well. Afghanistan is just old Iranian territory. We need a historical understanding.

Britain should be more concerned about things at home. Read about Operation Trident http://www.met.police.uk/trident/

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by Exeter

I think the former Soviet commanders are right.

As a matter of fact...

MoD updates Afghanistan injury toll

The Guardian
September 30, 2006

Ten British soldiers were seriously injured in Afghanistan during intense fighting against Taliban forces in the last few days of August, the Ministry of Defence revealed last night.

The figure compares with the total of 13 seriously, or very seriously, injured for the entire year up to then.

The MoD indicated that a relatively high number of soldiers were also wounded in the first week of September when "serious casualties and fatalities were sustained in a mine strike and attacks with enemy forces".

A total of 29 British military personnel were killed in southern Afghanistan over the past two months, including 14 who died in the crash of an RAF Nimrod reconnaissance aircraft.

The MoD released provisional figures of the number of seriously wounded in late August even though they are not included in the latest monthly table of casualty figures produced yesterday.

It is sensitive to past claims that it has covered up the number of casualties. Though the ministry publishes details of fatalities as soon as they are known, casualty figures are published a month in arrears. This, it says, allows time to check for any double or undercounting as the information is collated from both UK and Nato sources.

Official MoD figures published yesterday showed that between January 1 and August 29 - the cut-off date, before the heavy casualties of the following two weeks - 41 personnel were admitted to medical facilities and categorised as wounded in action. Forty-five were admitted to UK and coalition medical facilities as a result of "non-battle injuries", eight were categorised as "very seriously injured" and five "seriously injured".


[source]


I guess that if follows last week report where Ministry accused over Afghan casualty figures.

Interesting to say the least.

[Menydh]

Canadian soldier killed in Afghanistan

The Globe and Mail
September 29, 2006

KANDAHAR, AFGHANISTAN — A young private on a foot patrol died Friday when he stepped on an insurgent's explosive booby trap, adding to the Canadian military's biggest monthly death toll in decades.

The soldier from the First Battalion, Royal Canadian Regiment, based in Petawawa, Ont., died around 1 p.m. when he stepped on the bomb in the Panjwai district west of Kandahar city.

The explosive was big enough to be an anti-tank mine, an official said.

[...]

He is the 10th Canadian soldier to die in Afghanistan this month — and the 37th since 2002.

[...]

Earlier in the day, Mr. Hillier acknowledged Taliban resistance has grown and the pace of reconstruction is frustrating local residents and the army. The Taliban have dug in for conventional battle, conducted ambushes and then continued with a deadly suicide bombing campaign.

[...]

“It's a long, painful slow process here,” Mr. Hillier said. “They're not a conventional enemy. They don't have a postal code where we can go and target them directly.”

[...]

[source]

[Menydh]

‘Many' people killed in Afghan suicide attack, police say

The Globe and Mail
September 30, 2006

KABUL — A suicide bomber exploded next to Afghanistan's Interior Ministry on Saturday, killing at least 10 people and wounding 54, officials said.

Dr. Salam Jalali, a Public Health Ministry official, said many of the injured were in critical condition and that the death toll could rise. He said the 54 injured had been taken to six different hospitals in Kabul, complicating officials' efforts to keep track of the casualties.

The explosion happened a little before 8 a.m., as ministry employees were reporting to work, near a narrow dirt road where employees and civilians pass through a security gate.

Ambulances rushed to and from the bomb scene, which police had cordoned off. Windows of nearby shops were shattered, and tables were overturned and thrown to the back of the shops by the blast. At least three shops were destroyed.

[...]

[source]

[Susi]

It seems all that's in the news here is news of more Canadian soldiers being killed.

I believe seeing Harper on CPAC (Canadian political television, exciting stuff) vowing not to leave Afghanistan until the mission is completed. I mean 37ish people isn't a lot if you think about it, but it's not even a war my country started. It was an American war, if I recall.

So why is my country dragged into their stupid war?