Multiculturalism in England

[M.R.]

+ YouTube Video

England - whose England?

Small part of English documentary from 70is which openly discusses the immigration problem.

EDIT: part 2 of the documentary is in post #5

[gazumpiro]

Disgustingly one sided.

Immigration is a problem in some areas, I agree, and it should be highlighted and dealt with as appropriate. But in my opinion this is xenophobic at best and borders on racism at worst.

[M.R.]

It's not one sided. It's what majority of people think about it, but don't say it, or at least say it in more politicaly correct way, because of the pressure from the liberal-democratic society we live in, which can only shout "racist/fascist/nazi" as an answer.

It's even more problematic now than it was in the 70is, if they were doing documentary now, we would here much different answers, even though immigrations is worse and worse, but so is the brainwashing and pressure from our capitalist regime.

This is just people being honest and I like it. You'll see that one day when multiculturalist Europe will cross the point of no return, suddenly everyone will have opinion like this.

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by gazumpiro

Disgustingly one sided.

Immigration is a problem in some areas, I agree, and it should be highlighted and dealt with as appropriate. But in my opinion this is xenophobic at best and borders on racism at worst.

To provoke the systematic destruction of ethnic nations and societies, in order to focibly fit in other people, is utter racism.

To pretend that opposing to this form of racism, is racism, that is utter hipocrisy.

It is the people like you who promote racism and hatred.

[M.R.]

Part 2 of 2 of documentary

England - whose England?

+ YouTube Video

The best documentary about immigration by far. It shows everything as it is without any politicaly correct bullshit.

Copy URL link of the video, send it around, spread it, let the people hear the message.

They'll come to your town too!

[Errigal]

Originally Posted by gazumpiro

Disgustingly one sided.

Immigration is a problem in some areas, I agree, and it should be highlighted and dealt with as appropriate. But in my opinion this is xenophobic at best and borders on racism at worst.

It is one-sided, in the same way that any political essay or public affairs documentary is one-sided. So what? Is the evidence put forward true or not?

It is only "disgustingly one-sided" to people who think their role is to play teacher's pet for our Political Correct governing class. Go ahead and wag your finger and say this kind of talk is bad. I don't care.

[bombadillo]

Interesting videos though clearly somewhat dated. Areas like Southall are now completely Asian, at least on the high street (main commercial thoroughfare). And since the time the video was produced there has been more immigration.

What's interesting is the way the people interviewed speak of "colored immigrants." I presume if they were from Poland or Czech, that would be all right. Yet today it is the large influx from Central and Eastern Europe that is causing angst in England.

Immigration has been resisted by common English people right from the start. But their voices have often not been heard. In 1955, there was consternation when the number of immigrants reached 100,000 (though that figure seems like a joke today). In the lat '50s, some Tory MPs suggessted a bill to sterilise immigrant women. And in 1969, Enoch Powell made his famous "Rivers of Blood" speech. But step by step, British governments -- both Labour and Tory -- have tried to make immigration tighter as well as enact various race relation laws that make discrimination in housing and employment illegal. Under the Blair giovernment, immigration figures jumped again, from roughly 100,000 annually in the Thatcher and Major days to 200,000. And I'm not even counting East Europeans (500,000?, 1,000,000? no-one knows).

Britain is a small country and the fears and apprehensions voiced by many of the people in the video are well-placed: these are powerless and ordinary people who are legitimately worried about employment, housing, and ethnic homogeneity. They do not welcome changes that have been inflicted on them by a ruling class that doesn't have to live cheek-by-jowl with immigrants. Call this "xenophobia" if you wish. Any feeling of ethnic solidarity and identity will have a "xenophobic" aspect.

[gazumpiro]

Originally Posted by M.R.

It's not one sided. It's what majority of people think about it, but don't say it, or at least say it in more politicaly correct way, because of the pressure from the liberal-democratic society we live in, which can only shout "racist/fascist/nazi" as an answer.

I don't believe it is what the majority of people think. To say that this is the widespread belief but people just don't want to talk about it seems awfully convenient to me!

Originally Posted by Mynydd

To provoke the systematic destruction of ethnic nations and societies, in order to focibly fit in other people, is utter racism.

To pretend that opposing to this form of racism, is racism, that is utter hipocrisy.

It is the people like you who promote racism and hatred.

I am totally against the distruption of that which is native. But I am not against anything that can add to it. There are many, many immigrants who embrace Britain and her ways. This is fine for me. Those who don't want to be British, however, should not be permitted to stay.

That documentary is one sided. It brings up only negative aspects of immigration and represents the viewpoint of just a few angry individuals.

It sounds like you have just labelled me a racist and a hypocrite. I find this deeply offensive!

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by gazumpiro

I don't believe it is what the majority of people think. To say that this is the widespread belief but people just don't want to talk about it seems awfully convenient to me!

Then come with me to the neighbourhoods here, and talk to the average man and woman on the street. Only if you introduce yourself as some kind of politically correct police, who is going to put them a label if they say the "wrong" word (like you've done on your post), they will not speak their hearts out. Or even then, they might.

And I'll tell you more, it doesn't matter who they vote.

Get real, because it is only the fear to the politically correct, pro-multiculturalist police-establishment, that is holding the walls of what's to come.

I am totally against the distruption of that which is native. But I am not against anything that can add to it.

It is not as if we had no evidence that what you call 'add' is what destroys. You only play with words to make things look what they are not.

There are many, many immigrants who embrace Britain and her ways. This is fine for me. Those who don't want to be British, however, should not be permitted to stay.

Britain in itself is a multi-culturalist concept. But even if we forget about that for a second, you cannot rationally explain why those white British are leaving en masse the country. They have been literally displaced.

That documentary is one sided. It brings up only negative aspects of immigration and represents the viewpoint of just a few angry individuals.

It brings up what is the reality. Hundreds of thousands of Brits who are now refugee immigrants (call it ex-pats if you will, but that's just a label that hides the reality behind it) in other countries, are not a few angry individuals.

It sounds like you have just labelled me a racist and a hypocrite. I find this deeply offensive!

I call things and people for their names. I have never bowed to any political correctness or threats of any type.

You are a racist of the worse kind because you excuse and promote the ethnic destruction of peoples to suit your conveniences, and then you insult them if they dare raise their voices to claim a stop to this ethnic genocide.

[M.R.]

Originally Posted by bombadillo

What's interesting is the way the people interviewed speak of "colored immigrants." I presume if they were from Poland or Czech, that would be all right. Yet today it is the large influx from Central and Eastern Europe that is causing angst in England.

No, it won't be all right to these people. I'm sure about that. They're just pointing out that they're "colored". In the same way I would speak here about Balkan immigrants and that wouldn't mean "if they were Negro/Asian it would be ok". It's just that eastern Euro immigration wasn't an issue back then.

[bombadillo]

Originally Posted by M.R.

No, it won't be all right to these people. I'm sure about that. They're just pointing out that they're "colored". In the same way I would speak here about Balkan immigrants and that wouldn't mean "if they were Negro/Asian it would be ok". It's just that eastern Euro immigration wasn't an issue back then.

I know. It's the only way these people can give vent to their feelings about Pakistanis and West Indians. I would do the same.

What's interesting is the way class politics intersects with race politics in England. Most of the people in the video were working-class people objecting to government/ruling-class policies that had inflicted so many migrants on their communities. Without this class antagonism, there would not have been immigration to begin with. Most of this immigration had its basis in the British empire -- an empire which served ruling-class interests but didn't do much to improve the lot of ordinary working-class people. Now these people see themselves as being stuick with the bill, and not only that, but having to compete in their communities with these immigrants for housing and jobs.

[bombadillo]

Originally Posted by gazumpiro

I am totally against the distruption of that which is native. But I am not against anything that can add to it. There are many, many immigrants who embrace Britain and her ways. This is fine for me. Those who don't want to be British, however, should not be permitted to stay.

In a sense, everyone who comes to Britain embraces some aspect of it -- otherwise they wouldn't come. But that itself isn't justification to allow them to come to a densely populated isle with its own grave problems with regard to environment, jobs, housing, and welfare provision.

That documentary is one sided. It brings up only negative aspects of immigration and represents the viewpoint of just a few angry individuals.

Of course it's one-sided: that is its purpose. That doesn't invalidate its arguments. But I have yet to what the the other side is. What exact advantages does Britain derive from umpteen curry houses? What advantages other than the nebulous "drive" and "energy" that immigrants are always supposed to bring to a new country?

The individuals are not necessarily "angry." But they are clearly concerned at policies over which they have no control and which affect them adversely. Were they consulted with regard to immigration policies? Should they not have a voice? Are they mere serfs who should do the bidding of ruling-class masters?

[Lutiferre]

Originally Posted by M.R.

England - whose England?

Small part of English documentary from 70is which openly discusses the immigration problem.

EDIT: part 2 of the documentary is in post #5

Wow.. and that was in the 70s. Kind of makes todays England look like a hopeless case.

To whoever said this was racist at "worst" - if you think racism is bad, that makes you another one of those "anti-racists". Racisms actual definition from when the term was coined was the equivalent of what racialism means today - racialism used to mean discrimination and hatred, whereas racism used to be of or relating to races. You could call one who has realized the reality of races a "racist" and one who discriminates/hates others based on race a "racialist", i.e. beats down random racial foreigners, according to the original definitions. Racism is not inherently evil, because it simply means relating to races.

[gazumpiro]

Originally Posted by Mynydd

Then come with me to the neighbourhoods here, and talk to the average man and woman on the street. Only if you introduce yourself as some kind of politically correct police, who is going to put them a label if they say the "wrong" word (like you've done on your post), they will not speak their hearts out. Or even then, they might.

And I'll tell you more, it doesn't matter who they vote.

Get real, because it is only the fear to the politically correct, pro-multiculturalist police-establishment, that is holding the walls of what's to come.

It is not as if we had no evidence that what you call 'add' is what destroys. You only play with words to make things look what they are not.

Britain in itself is a multi-culturalist concept. But even if we forget about that for a second, you cannot rationally explain why those white British are leaving en masse the country. They have been literally displaced.

It brings up what is the reality. Hundreds of thousands of Brits who are now refugee immigrants (call it ex-pats if you will, but that's just a label that hides the reality behind it) in other countries, are not a few angry individuals.

I call things and people for their names. I have never bowed to any political correctness or threats of any type.

You are a racist of the worse kind because you excuse and promote the ethnic destruction of peoples to suit your conveniences, and then you insult them if they dare raise their voices to claim a stop to this ethnic genocide.

Well firstly, I don't think I deserved that, Mynydd.

I stand by what I said. That documentary is propoganda, promoting a single and inflammatory point of view.

I'm interested in your discussion and opinions, but I'm disappointed you feel you have to insult me personally.

British ex-pats leave the country because they are forced out? I've heard of seeking better climate, I've heard of professional development and I've heard of adventure. I've never known anyone leave Britain to escape immigrants. I'm interested to know if you have anything to back up your claim?

Let me ask you this - if an immigrant Muslim was hurt in a accident and you were first on the scene, would you call help for him?