Stirpes  

Go Back   Stirpes > Newsroom & Current Affairs > Europe In The News > The Tabloid

The Tabloid Second line in importance news and events.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Tuesday, April 29th, 2008
Aptrgangr's Avatar
Furchtlos und Treu
 
Last Online: 6 Hours Ago 20:52
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Deutschland/Germany
Posts: 1,778
Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.Aptrgangr 's wisdom is sought by the gods.
Default Oh what a lovely war!

Quote:
Oh what a lovely war! The dazzling photos of innocent Parisian fun that make the French so ashamed

By ROBERT HARDMAN - More by this author » Last updated at 22:00pm on 25th April 2008

Three girls enjoy the sunshine in the latest a la mode sunglasses.

Shoppers meander through a market piled high with fruit and veg. There is barely a seat to be had at the fashionable Cafe des Deux Magots in the chi-chi Paris quarter of Saint-Germain-de-Pres.

At Longchamps, France's smartest racecourse, the It-girls of the day are parading in dazzling hats.

It is hard to imagine that these fabulously vivid images of innocent Parisian fun have prompted one leading politician to declare that they make him want to "vomit".
A ferocious national debate is under way. Amid demands for censorship, these photos now even come with their own official health warning.


Does he look under threat? A lone unarmed German soldier walks down the Metro steps as Parisians get on with the hustle and bustle of their daily lives

But then, it is equally hard to believe the dates on these photographs. Every one was taken during the hell of the Nazi regime.

According to received wisdom among the French, the Occupation was a time of unspeakable deprivation and cruelty.

That is the story France has been repeating to itself for 64 years, ever since General de Gaulle turned up in a Paris newly-liberated by the Americans and praised a "martyred" capital for bravely freeing itself.

But it is not exactly the story which leaps out of these pictures. And that is why an exhibition of them in the basement of a Parisian library has attracted the wrath of the French establishment - as well as queues around the block.
For some, like the deputy mayor of Paris, Christophe Girard, the explanation is simple: these images are a shameful case of Nazi propaganda. "It's complete manipulation. And it makes me vomit."


Luxury for some: Women enjoy the racing at Longchamps in high style

For others, it is an important reminder that many Parisians had a very cushy war, insulated from hardship by money and/or collaboration with the enemy.

In a nation which has never been comfortable about its four years as a Nazi satellite state, it is time to squirm again.

Paris was certainly not easy for everyone. In the same month these girls were photographed, the edict went out (from the French authorities) that all Jews should wear a yellow star.

Don't look up: Cyclists in the Rue de Rivoli

By the war's end, France had sent 76,000 Jews, including 11,000 children, to their deaths.

Millions of ordinary Frenchmen had also been deported to work in Germany. But you will see none of that among the 270 images in Paris's Bibliotheque Historique. Just two show people with yellow stars (moving freely).

I find a long queue at the library. The exhibition can only accommodate 200 at a time and thousands have been turning up. It runs until July. Inside, there is silence as the people shuffle into the display.

By order of the Mayor, each one is handed a leaflet explaining that the exhibition "doesn't show the reality of occupation".
These are all the work of Andre Zucca, a photojournalist who had worked for big publications including Paris Match before the Second World War.

After the fall of France in 1940, he was "requisitioned" to work for the Paris edition of a Nazi propaganda magazine called Signal.

It gave him access to the latest German colour film. After the liberation, Zucca became a wedding photographer in the provinces. He died in 1973. Years later, the city bought his archive from his family.
"These pictures provide a very important chronological connection to the present," says Jean Derens, the library's chief conservator. "But I was not expecting this sort of criticism."

It was not long in coming. "It put me so ill at ease that I left," said Christophe Girard. "I immediately understood the manipulation behind these false happy images."

His conclusion was that Zucca had worked for Signal magazine, Signal was propaganda and, thus, these images were propaganda - showing the world a contented Nazi Paris.

Not so, insisted the curator and author of the accompanying book, Jean Baronnet. He pointed out that Zucca was not taking these images for his Nazi editors - not a single one of these photos was ever published.

These were snapshots of Parisian life by a compulsive photographer.


Still the city of love: In the Luxembourg Gardens

None the less, the Mayor of Paris, Bernard Delanoe, duly asked Derens to hand every visitor a leaflet stressing Zucca's Nazi credentials. The exhibition had to be put "in context". The library answers to the Mayor so Derens has done as he was told.

The leaflet could do with some context of its own. For instance, it warns that the pictures fail to show the Resistance which "had been active in Paris as early as 1940".

Aside from the fact that its members could have met in a phone box in 1940, why would any Resistance member have allowed himself to be snapped at work?

Since then, however, the debate has escalated. This week's edition of L'Express magazine has an Occupation image on the cover and plenty of wartime navel-gazing within. Some critics have demanded that the exhibition should be shut down.

Only a small minority of images show a German presence and, even then, there is no obvious interaction between the occupiers and the hosts.

France appears, simply, to be getting on with its life.

So what do the French people themselves think? There is a well-thumbed comment book at the exit. Most entries commend the exhibition. "Down with censorship!" says one.


Rose-tinted view? Three fashionable young female students model the latest eyewear in Luxembourg Gardens, Paris 1942

At the exit, I canvass opinion. "They are selective, yes, but it is very important that people see these pictures," says Charles Weissberg, 76.

"Was it really like that?" I ask. "For some, yes. But not for me. I had to wear a yellow star."

He tells me how he fled the Jewish round-ups, surviving as a farm boy while his father died at Auschwitz.

"For many people, Paris was a nice place," says Helen Sukno. "But I just remember..." Her words tail off and then she splutters: "La peur! ('The fear!') La peur! La peur!"

She, too, is Jewish, and was ten when her father was deported, never to be seen again. Yes, she says, some Parisians had an easy war. Why hide the fact?

Another woman emerges. "Are we embarrassed? Everyone is embarrassed by our history," she announces.

Despite these views, officialdom is obviously still very cross. I am summoned to meet the Mayor's cultural adviser. Colombe Brossel says the Mayor has now demanded all publicity is taken down and the panels next to the photographs are to be rewritten.

"Visitors must know that this is a very narrow vision of the war."


Shortages, what shortages? Shoppers stroll along the Rue de Belleville, while elsewhere in France, many are suffering deprivation

The next day, I meet M Baronnet. "I was here through the war as a child and it really was like this," he says.

"There was great hunger and persecution for many. But others lived well.
"These politicians complain about propaganda but they want to tell the public what to think about this exhibition before they have even seen it."

I hire a bike and ride down the Rue de Rivoli, just like the cyclists in one of Zucca's pictures. The swastika flags have gone - to be replaced by those of the EU. But nothing else has changed. Paris had no Blitz.
True, some of its citizens were incredibly brave but others behaved abominably. And while they committed their crimes against humanity, most people just got on with their lives as best they could.
That might be an inconvenient truth. But it's well worth a look.
Oh what a lovely war! The dazzling photos of innocent Parisian fun that make the French so ashamed | the Daily Mail
__________________
Aptrgangr sagt:
I am republican anyway
Lutiferre sagt:
me too, but thats mostly because i am against monarchy





„Noch sitzt Ihr da oben, Ihr feigen Gestalten. Vom Feinde bezahlt, doch dem Volke zum Spott! Doch einst wird wieder Gerechtigkeit walten, dann richtet das Volk, dann gnade Euch Gott!“
(Theodor Körner 1791-1813)
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Tuesday, April 29th, 2008
svin's Avatar
Administrator
 
Last Online: Tuesday, May 27th, 2008 04:10
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,209
svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.svin 's wisdom is legendary.
Default Re: Oh what a lovely war!

A major part of Juenger WWII diaries is about his service as a German officer in occupied Paris. The description of Paris is very interesting; Juenger was constantly meeting with various French intellectuals, writers, poets and painters there.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Tuesday, April 29th, 2008
Errigal's Avatar
Member
 
Last Online: 1 Hour Ago 01:22
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,511
Blog Entries: 9
Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.
Default Re: Oh what a lovely war!

I thought this excerpt from Paris After The Liberation 1944-1949 might give people a better idea of Paris during and just after German occupation:

(Did a quick OCR scan from my copy of the book so some of the French accents were lost.)

Quote:
Chapter 13
The Return of Exiles


The steady stream of exiles returning to Paris in 1944 and 1945 came from all classes and several nationalities. Many workers and their families, who had been close to starvation in the city, had sought shelter with peasant relatives. Hitching rides in different sorts of wood-burning vehicles, or on trains once the tracks were repaired, they returned with their few possessions in cardboard suitcases. Wherever possible, they brought a sack or two of flour back with them, either to sell or to keep them through the months ahead. Few took much notice of their arrival in the upheaval of the times. But the exiles whose return Parisians remembered for the rest of their lives were the deportés who arrived back from Germany in the spring of 1945.

The term deporte was loosely used to cover three different categories of prisoner: Jewish and other racial minorities sent to extermination camps, members of the Resistance sent to concentration camps, and conscripts sent on forced labour by the Vichy government from 1943. The prisoners of war from the defeat in 1940 were treated no differently from their British, Dutch and Belgian counterparts.

In April 1945, the advancing armies found themselves liberating one camp after another. The commanders, their attention focused on finishing the war, were unprepared to cope with the problem of feeding and caring for hundreds of thousands of civilians, many of whom were close to death. All too often, they were given ration packs and told to fend for themselves until the fighting was over.

Relatives waiting for news in Paris found the mixture of hope and fear very hard to bear. It often produced a feverish nausea. Sleep was impossible. The novelist Marguerite Duras sat by the telephone, convinced that her husband, Robert Antelme, had been among those executed at the last moment by the SS before the Allies arrived. Whenever it rang, the caller turned out to be a friend asking: `Any news?'

Even when transport was finally organized for repatriation, the process was still slow. The journey back to France could take five days. (As soon as the war ended in May, the Americans allocated the bulk of their transport aircraft to ferrying back prisoners and the whole procedure speeded up immeasurably.) Some passed through Switzerland via Geneva, where Pierre de Gaulle, the General's brother, was consul. The depth of his sympathy was in no doubt. Pierre Daix, a young Communist who had survived Mauthausen, found himself spontaneously embraced.

On 14 April 1945 at the Gare de Lyon, an official reception committee,
which included General de Gaulle, Henri Frenay, Francois Mitterrand and the two Communist leaders Jacques Duclos and Andre Marty, waited to welcome back the first group of 288 women. Well-wishers carried lilac blossom to present to them and women brought lipsticks and face powder to distribute. They expected the returning prisoners to look thin and tired from their experiences, but not much more. France had been partially shielded from the appalling truth. The French ministry with responsibility for prisoners, deportees and refugees had been trying to suppress information about the camps, just when General Eisenhower was calling for every available journalist to be brought in to Germany to report on their horrors. Few had imagined the reality of virtual skeletons dressed like scarecrows. `Their faces were grey-green with reddish brown circles round their eyes, which seemed to see but not to take in,' wrote Janet Flanner, the American journalist. Galtier-Boissiere described deportees as having `a greenish, waxen complexion, shrunken faces, reminiscent of those little human heads modelled by primitive tribes'. Some were too weak to remain upright, but those who could stood to attention in front of the welcoming committee and began to sing the Marseillaise in cracked voices. Their audience was devastated.

Such scenes were repeated many times. Louise Alcan, aged thirty-four, a survivor of Birkenau and Ravensbruck, described her own arrival: 'Gare de l'Est. Eight in the morning. A crowd behind the barriers. We sing the Marseillaise. The people look at us and burst into tears.'

The few French Jews who returned from the death camps aligned themselves with their compatriots. Vichy had stripped them of their nationality and handed them over to the Germans, but they were no less French for that; they too sang the Marseillaise and the `Chant du depart', that battle anthem of the French Revolution. Only a tiny percentage of almost 80,000 `racial deportees' returned; over a quarter of the entire population of French Jews had perished. Vichy had also handed over another 40,000 foreign Jews who had sought refuge in France. In addition there were around 100,000 political prisoners and the 600,000 conscripts on forced labour, many of whom had worked and died while constructing factories underground to escape Allied bombing. Out of a total of 820,000 French deportees, some 222,000 are estimated to have died.

The first processing point was at the Gare d'Orsay. General Dixie Redman took his military assistant Mary Vaudoyer there, having told her: `You must see this, and you must never forget it.' They stood looking out of a window into a huge space where hundreds of men were walking, completely naked, covered in delousing powder and DDT, such was the fear of typhus. Their faces were cavernous, their heads bald, either shaved or with alopecia from malnutrition, their eyes downcast. None spoke. Both Redman and his assistant were appalled that they should be obliged to undergo yet one more humiliation. When they were deemed to have been disinfected, they were dressed in surplus British battledress, coarse, hot and often several sizes too big for them, and heavy ammunition boots.

From the Gare d'Orsay, the deportees were taken to the Hotel Lutetia, which had been the Abwehr headquarters during the Occupation. The whole block was surrounded by relatives desperate for news. Newspapers were full of little advertisements seeking information on missing relatives, or announcements of deaths at last confirmed. Such was the confusion and the scale of the task that some families had to wait several more months.

Marguerite Duras's husband was saved by a miracle and by determination. Francois Mitterrand, the leader of Antelme's Resistance group, was part of a semi-official French mission sent to Germany. He managed to get into Dachau, which had been sealed off by the US army to prevent the spread of typhus. A voice called out, `Francois!' He did not recognize the living corpse. It was his companion who recognized Robert Antelme, and then only by his teeth.

Mitterrand rang Duras in Paris. He told her to send two members of the group to his office, where he had organized passes and three uniforms. Using a car and petrol obtained by Mitterrand, the two friends drove through the night, reaching Dachau the next morning. They dressed this virtual skeleton in the spare uniform which they had smuggled into the camp and carried him out, held upright between them, past the guard post. Fortunately, the American sentries were so afraid of infection that they all wore gas masks and could not see very clearly. Antelme was laid on the back seat of their car and driven back to Paris. The return journey took three times as long. None of them expected him to survive it. But when they finally reached the rue Saint-Benoit, he was still alive. Despite all the warnings of how he had changed, Duras herself nearly suffered a nervous breakdown and had to be revived with rum by a neighbour. The concierge who had decorated the entrance to welcome him home shut herself in her loge to cry in anger.

Everything possible was done for the deportees at the Lutetia. By right of suffering, they were known as `the best of the French'. Nothing was too good for them: veal, cheese and real coffee, obtainable only on the black market, were produced. But often the best intentions did not effect the right treatment. Deportees needed the simplest food in tiny quantities. Their stomachs were so unprepared for the change that they were violently ill. They also needed peace and quiet, not the pandemonium around the Lutetia. `We really felt like Martians,' wrote Pierre Daix.

Some had survived their ordeals in the most astonishing way. Among those flown in from Germany was the Comtesse de Mauduit, an American who had hidden Allied airmen in her chateau in Brittany until a maid denounced her. Bessie de Mauduit arrived from Ravensbruck `still dressed in the striped uniform of prisoners, yet still very elegant'. She told her story to Jean and Charlotte Galtier-Boissiere: `I never cried once in two years of captivity,' she concluded, with a proud smile, `but I cried on seeing Paris again.' A few days later Galtier-Boissiere learned that Bessie de Mauduit had managed to look so elegant in her camp uniform because a forewoman from Schiaparelli, a fellow prisoner, had refashioned it for her.

The resistants survived best in the long run, while 'kapos' and collaborators - with what might be seen retrospectively as moral justice - had the lowest survival rate. Those who had tried to obliterate their own individuality in an attempt to make themselves invisible to kapos or S S guards may have survived better in the short term; but turning off a psychological switch to become an apathetic automaton - they were known as 'musulmans' in the camps - made it almost impossible to recover afterwards. Altogether 6,00o deportees died soon after their return, of whom 'musulmans' made up a significant proportion.

The difficulty of returning to their old lives was common to all. They were unable to sleep in a soft bed. They suffered from nightmares and a lack of confidence. Worst of all, in a way, was the disappointment in homecoming: their families found it very hard to cope with their depressions, caused largely by survivor guilt. `Joy did not come,' wrote Daix, "because we had brought too many dead back with us."

Their whole relationship with the normal world had been completely distorted by their recent submersion in the nightmare of the 'univers concentrationnaire'. Charles Spitz, a resistant-deporte who had worked in the Dora tunnel, found that the habits of the prison camp died hard. Two months after his return to Paris, his wife suggested they go and have dinner in a restaurant. `She had bought me the whole panoply of civilized man, including a wallet and purse. But, without her knowledge, I still kept in my pocket a little wooden box which a comrade from Dora had made for me. It contained some bits of string, pins, and other treasures which were precious in the camp ... When it came to pay the bill, to everybody's stupefaction, I automatically opened my box and emptied its contents on the table.'

The prisoners of war were processed at the Rex and Gaumont cinemas. One prisoner, just arrived from Germany, when asked where his home was in France, replied that he was from Oradour. The person in charge of interviewing him fainted, unable to tell him that the village and almost all its inhabitants had been destroyed by the SS Das Reich Division.

There were many tragedies awaiting them, both great and small. In a number of cases, a prisoner reached his apartment to be told by a neighbour that his wife had gone to live with another man. One arrived home to find a child of whose existence he had never been told. His wife was not there, having slipped out to the shops. The man's jealousy exploded after five years of prison camp and he killed the child. He then went off to surrender to the police. But the child was not his wife's by another man. She had just been acting as a child-minder, to earn a little money.

Special Operations Executive, whose captured agents had been sent to concentration camps, devoted great efforts to finding them in the crowds at the Gare d'Orsay. Teams of FANYs (the young women of the First Aid Nursing Yeomanry attached to SOE) worked in relays trying to spot survivors who had changed almost out of all recognition. The task was so distressing that one or two of them had nervous breakdowns.

SOE had already set up a base in Paris by taking over the Hotel Cecil in the rue Lauriston, and was doing all it could to help its agents, their families and those who had assisted in other ways, with food from US army bulk ration packs. This had to done discreetly, because it was strictly against regulations. They were all invited to eat at the Cecil, then encouraged to take away as much as they could afterwards.

Apart from its own refugees, France found itself responsible for over 100,000 displaced persons of forty-seven nationalities by July 1945. They included 30,00o Russians, of whom11,800 were prisoners of war, 31,500 Poles and 24,000 Yugoslavs.

Since long before the First World War, Paris had been the haven for refugees from all over Europe, fleeing autocracy, pogroms and violent nationalism. Bolshevism and then fascism in all its forms vastly increased the flow. Since 1900 foreign communities had swelled in Paris, with Armenians escaping the Turkish massacres; White Russians escaping the Revolution and civil war; and Poles, mainly Jewish, fleeing Pilsudski's regime. Political fugitives arrived from Mussolini's Italy and the Balkan dictatorships; then Jews, left-wingers and liberals from Hitler's Germany and other countries subsequently occupied by the Nazis. Finally, in 1939, came the largest wave of all when over half a million defeated Spanish Republicans crossed the Pyrenees, fleeing Franco's execution squads.

The largest Jewish ghetto had been in the 20th arrondissement, `le village yiddish de Belleville' just north-west of Pere Lachaise. The oldest was in the Marais; but the Jewish professional classes were spread all over the middle-class districts of Paris. People who had undergone the most appalling tortures and humiliations had to relearn how to be doctors, teachers, lawyers and businessmen. The only way they could do this was to lock away the past at the back of their minds and never to refer to it. Richard Artz, who grew up in a French Jewish family in the late 1940s, said that in his house the Holocaust and the sufferings of the Jews were simply never mentioned. When a female cousin became engaged to a German many years later, Arzt was astonished at the depths of rancour and pain that the announcement aroused.
....
pages 145-151 of Paris After The Liberation 1944-1949 by Antony Beevor and Artemis Cooper
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Tuesday, April 29th, 2008
Senior Moderator
 
Last Online: 5 Hours Ago 20:57
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,886
Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.Arthur Gordon Pym is a deity.
Default Re: Oh what a lovely war!

Any time any subject concerning the Second World War is taken up, it always takes on a peculiar über-moralizing overtone. It would not be by itself a problem if the principle were applied consistently concerning every other war as well.

And even in the case of this war the über-moralizing attitude is reserved almost exclusively when judging actions of the "wrong side" or of those who were allegedly too passive and did not yield significant resistance to the "wrong side" in the conflict.

Maybe it would be somewhat understandable if it were practiced few years after the conflict ended, but now it is 63 years that elapsed from the end of the war, which makes it puzzling.

Last edited by Arthur Gordon Pym; Tuesday, April 29th, 2008 at 15:59.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Tuesday, April 29th, 2008
Errigal's Avatar
Member
 
Last Online: 1 Hour Ago 01:22
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,511
Blog Entries: 9
Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.Errigal 's wisdom is legendary.
Default Re: Oh what a lovely war!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marulus View Post
Any time any subject concerning the Second World War is taken up, it always takes on a peculiar über-moralizing overtone. It would not be by itself a problem if the principle were applied consistently concerning every other war as well.
And also it seems almost anything can be said about WW2 as long as it reflects negatively on the Axis side. What actually happened from 1939 to 1945 is just a starting point for whatever fantasy a journalist can invent. Anyone who says, for example, he doesn't think Nazi Germany would have exterminated the Irish as subhumans if they'd won the war, can be accused of being a neo-Nazi by the stupider followers of political correctness.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Monday, June 2nd, 2008
orieleye's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Last Online: 9 Hours Ago 17:49
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 263
orieleye 's opinion is sought out by learned men.orieleye 's opinion is sought out by learned men.orieleye 's opinion is sought out by learned men.
Default http://forum.stirpes.net/tabloid/17705-oh-what-lovely-war.html


A recent exhibition of pictures from occupied Paris has revealed a more relaxed image of the city

Quote:
A new book which suggests that the German occupation of France encouraged the sexual liberation of women has shocked a country still struggling to come to terms with its troubled history of collaboration with the Nazis.

Like a recent photographic exhibition showing Parisians enjoying themselves under the occupation, the book’s depiction of life in Paris as one big party is at odds with the collective memory of hunger, resistance and fear.

“It is a taboo subject, a story nobody wants to hear,” said Patrick Buisson, author of 1940-1945 Années Erotiques (“erotic years”). “It may hurt our national pride, but the reality is that people adapted to occupation.”

Many might prefer to forget but, with their husbands in prison camps, numerous women slept not only with German soldiers – the young “blond barbarians” were particularly attractive to French women, says Buisson – but also conducted affairs with anyone else who could help them through financially difficult times: “They gave way to the advances of the boss, to the tradesman they owed money to, their neighbour. In times of rationing, the body is the only renewable, inexhaustible currency.”
Paris during Nazi occupation was "one big romp" - Times Online

Photo exhibit shows Paris under Nazi occupation, minus the misery - International Herald Tribune
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Monday, June 2nd, 2008
Menydh's Avatar
Southern Charm,
Western Passion
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 16,253
Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.Menydh is a deity.
Default Re: Paris during Nazi occupation was ‘one big romp’

To call it that the Germans brought the "sexual liberation of the women" to France is ludicrous...vicious to say the least.

Compare this:
Quote:
Many might prefer to forget but, with their husbands in prison camps, numerous women slept not only with German soldiers – the young “blond barbarians” were particularly attractive to French women, says Buisson – but also conducted affairs with anyone else who could help them through financially difficult times: “They gave way to the advances of the boss, to the tradesman they owed money to, their neighbour. In times of rationing, the body is the only renewable, inexhaustible currency.”
To this:
Quote:
Thousands of illegitimate mixed-race children fathered by American GIs were given up by their British mothers and shipped across the Atlantic, according to newly released papers.

[...]

"In several cases they are married women whose husbands are in the army, usually overseas, and they usually get letters from their husbands saying 'Well, I am very sorry to hear about it. If you can get the child adopted everything will be all right.'

Mixed-race babies 'were sent to the US'
And this:
Quote:
As US troops crossed into Germany, General Eisenhower gave his men strict orders to stay away from the locals. But thousands struck up relations with German women, and many of them fathered children they never knew.

[...]

Corned beef and cigarettes

In 1945, Christa Ronke was 16 years old and working at an officers' mess hall in southwestern Berlin. "The GIs had an eye for the girls!" she said. "At first they saw us all as Nazis, but they soon relaxed. And they seemed so well-off, so good-looking and casual -- and they stood for the whole American way of life. They were hard to resist!"

After six years of a war which had left their own men either dead or physically and psychologically traumatized, the US servicemen were an irresistible draw for Germany's lonely, starving women.

The men could get them corned beef and cigarettes -- and show them a good time. "They had chocolate and silk stockings," said Ronke. "There were no German men left, but then suddenly there were all these young Americans to go out dancing with. They weren't like the Russians, who were so scrawny and poor -- compared, to them, even we Germans had a lot. It was the girls with American boyfriends who were envied."

[...]

"American soldiers together with German women was a common sight," said Ronke. "They were crazy times."

Three out of four GIs had sexual encounters overseas, and by late 1945, one in five German babies was born out of wedlock. By 1955, up to 67,700 illegitimate children had been fathered by US soldiers -- some 5,000 of whom were Afro-American.

Sleeping With the Enemy
Would anyone say that American GIs (Black or White) brought the "sexual liberation of the women" to Britain and to Germany?
__________________
'Dardanidae duri, quae uos a stirpe parentum
prima tulit tellus, eadem uos ubere laeto
accipiet reduces. Antiquam exquirite matrem:
hic domus Aeneae cunctis dominabitur oris,
et nati natorum, et qui nascentur ab illis.'



We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light.

–Plato–

'Many people, I believe, wish for a society where faith, decency, pro-life convictions and national self-determination within Europe can flourish; and not be swallowed up in a dictatorial EU bureaucracy.'

Gerry McGeough, Irish Nationalist and POW–

Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Monday, June 2nd, 2008
Susi's Avatar
J'ai mis mon chapeau en Ontario
 
Last Online: 42 Minutes Ago 02:14
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canuckistan
Age: 18
Posts: 3,390
Blog Entries: 10
Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.Susi 's wisdom is legendary.
Default Re: Paris during Nazi occupation was ‘one big romp’

No, I'd say American GIs brought the sexual exploitation of women to Britain and Germany.
__________________
suchen. geben. lieben. leben.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Monday, June 2nd, 2008
orieleye's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Last Online: 9 Hours Ago 17:49
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 263
orieleye 's opinion is sought out by learned men.orieleye 's opinion is sought out by learned men.orieleye 's opinion is sought out by learned men.
Default Re: Paris during Nazi occupation was ‘one big romp’

Quote:
Originally Posted by Menydh View Post
To call it that the Germans brought the "sexual liberation of the women" to France is ludicrous...vicious to say the least...

Would anyone say that American GIs (Black or White) brought the "sexual liberation of the women" to Britain and to Germany?
You're right. The Frenchmen were in captivity so it's ludicrous to talk of liberation.

One can only think that this book is a reaction to the historiography of liberation by the resistance, which probably has a leftist tinge to it. And then feminism and homo-sexualism followed; also projected as liberating. So it could be an indirect attack on today's ruling dogmas. I don't know.

It's in bad taste anyway.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Monday, June 2nd, 2008
Amorsite's Avatar
no 'authorities', common sense
 
Last Online: 52 Minutes Ago 02:04
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 802
Amorsite 's opinion is sought out by learned men.Amorsite 's opinion is sought out by learned men.Amorsite 's opinion is sought out by learned men.Amorsite 's opinion is sought out by learned men.Amorsite 's opinion is sought out by learned men.
Default Re: Paris during Nazi occupation was ‘one big romp’

sexual liberation from what?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Monday, June 2nd, 2008
Strengthandhonour's Avatar
Risorgimento Legionario!
 
Last Online: 1 Hour Ago 01:01
Join Date: Dec 2004
Age: 21
Posts: 2,526
Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.Strengthandhonour 's judgement is sought by kings.
Default Re: Paris during Nazi occupation was ‘one big romp’

I think Amorsite hit the nail right in the head..from what exactly?
__________________
"I failed my metaphysics exam when my teacher caught me looking into the soul of the boy next to me"

Some find it in a flag, some in the beat of a drum
Some with a book, and some with a gun
Some in a kiss, and some on the march
But if you're looking for Europe, best look in your heart
-Sol Invictus

+ YouTube Video
ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)     Quote this post in a PM
Old Wednesday, June 4th, 2008
Llywarch Hen's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Last Online: 1 Week Ago 11:25
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 371
Llywarch Hen is considered wise by the elders.Llywarch Hen is considered wise by the elders.Llywarch Hen is considered wise by the elders.Llywarch Hen is considered wise by the elders.Llywarch Hen is considered wise by the elders.Llywarch Hen is considered wise by the elders.Llywarch Hen is considered wise by the elders.
Default Re: Oh what a lovely war!

Quote:
Three girls enjoy the sunshine in the latest a la mode sunglasses...
God Almighty, that's a stupid article! Were people all over Europe seriously expected to wear miserable faces for six years?!?

Times are even worse now, as the very demographic, racial and religious make up of our Continent is being changed beyond recognition, and yet, lo and behold, you can even find pictures of people who are aware of it all with the odd smile on their faces! Strewth!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
None