Religion in today's nationalism

[Strengthandhonour]

The other day I had an interesting discussion with an individual who is to remain anonymous. He stated that if it wasn't for christianity, Europe woudln't be the mess that it is today and that if Rome had never turned christian, it would had probably outlasted itself quite a bit, as well as Byzantium's futille attempts to recapture the glory of the empire.
I stated to him that I do not consider myself a Catholic, yet I feel very close to that faith since I grew up around it since it's my family's religion and the faith of many of my friends.
I went on to state that many of the greatest Europeans have been catholic and that if it wasn't for christianity,that the victory at Lepanto would had never happened and that the heathens had allied themselves with the Huns when they invaded Europe. He went on to state that he only cares about preserving indo-European religious traditions.
What are the thoughts and opinions regarding this?

[Milesian]

The other day I had an interesting discussion with an individual who is to remain anonymous. He stated that if it wasn't for christianity, Europe woudln't be the mess that it is today and that if Rome had never turned christian, it would had probably outlasted itself quite a bit, as well as Byzantium's futille attempts to recapture the glory of the empire.
I stated to him that I do not consider myself a Catholic, yet I feel very close to that faith since I grew up around it since it's my family's religion and the faith of many of my friends.
I went on to state that many of the greatest Europeans have been catholic and that if it wasn't for christianity,that the victory at Lepanto would had never happened and that the heathens had allied themselves with the Huns when they invaded Europe. He went on to state that he only cares about preserving indo-European religious traditions.
What are the thoughts and opinions regarding this?

Well, your friend might be right in as much as we wouldn't be in this mess, but we'd almost certainly be in a different kind of mess.

You are right about the Battle of Lepanto. In fact it is quite likely that Europe would be Muslim today.
We'd also most likely be less technologically advanced. True, the Muslims were once quite enlightened and progressive but this was largely because they had come to possess ancient classical knowledge (from Greek and Roman sources), while Europe lost much of this knowledge as it was plunged into the Dark Ages which followed the Barbarian hordes and the subsequent collapse of Rome.

Rome itself, didn't fall because of Christianity.
There were several different reason.

1) Mass movement of Germanic peoples, being pushed west and south by even more easterly peoples including Asiatics (Huns, etc). This meant that Rome was being pressured by a great mass of different peoples all being pushed towards it from behind.
The "Wolves were at the door", so to speak.

2) Pagan Rome had become decadent and had over-expanded. It was internally corrupt and rotten.
This rot had set in long before Christianity had came to the Empire. In fact, St Augustine wrote at length to refute the suggestion that Christianity played a part in the fall. He masterly shows that Rome had been doomed to fall for a long time.

I understand that it is very unfashionable to defend Christianity or even have a good word to say about it this whether.
However, there is a saying about never kicking a man when he was down. And despite many people jumping on the bandwagon to aim kicks at Christianity while it is currently weak, I refuse to be drawn into such a mob mentality.
The truth speaks for itself - Christianity was a force which united Europe in spirit, defended it from outside threats, developed European knowledge and culture through it's universities, monastries and other centres of learning which then gave Europeans the advantage in latter times of being the most progressive, advanced and dynamic people on the face of the earth.

The objective truth, uncomfortable for some and their own emotional personal opinions aside, is that Christianity was a greater force for good than for bad. One can trace modern society's real decline from the 18th century - when Christianity began to be rejected. To further reject Christianity and demonise it with all that modern propganda can throw at it will only exacerbate our problems, hardly solve them.

[Strengthandhonour]

I would agree 100% with the fall of Rome. What bothers me about this "Nationalists" is that they see themselves as pagans/heathens first and then as Nationalists. It has also become a trend, most of this pseudo-Pagans think they are pagans because they do some prairs they read on some website, most don't even practice it.
I don't have anything against indo-European religions, I admire them quite a bit actually and I am very interested on learning about them. I just find it ridiculious when it is said that christianity corrupted Europe. Some of this individuals claim that paganism bounded Europeans together, but they are to be reminded that if you think Europeans fought among themselves when christianity was around, to read some history books and look at how things were before christianity showed up.

[vascongado]

The Christianity has not corrupt Europa. Who says it, does not know what he says.

You are right about the Battle of Lepanto. In fact it is quite likely that Europe would be Muslim today.

Yes. And we don't forgett the heroical resistance of Wien against the Soliman's otomans and more and more battles in defense of our countries and our faith.

I agree with the arguments that has written for Milesian:

The truth speaks for itself - Christianity was a force which united Europe in spirit, defended it from outside threats, developed European knowledge and culture through it's universities, monastries and other centres of learning which then gave Europeans the advantage in latter times of being the most progressive, advanced and dynamic people on the face of the earth.

It's a great true, Milesian.

About the Roman Empire, I think the fall of this civilization was a gradual process. In Spain, we have one phrase what says "everything what rises, it goes down".

The Roman Empire foll for the pressure of the Barbarian peoples and for a large political and economical crisis.

Also I believe that the relation between the Christianity and the patriotic European movements it'sevident. The religion has given to our patriotism one spiritual and eternal perspective, thing that the communism and similar ideologies don't have.

A patriot not only fights for the Fatherland. He fights also for God, for an eternal existence. It is what separates us from our enemies. They look for earthly goods, but we have above our eyes.