Women in "the movement"

[wilpuri]

I just found two German articles dealing with increased female representation in nationalist movements:

Study Claims Women Rising in Far-Right Ranks | Germany | Deutsche Welle | 02.02.2008 (2008)

Poll: Surprising Number of German Women Lean to Far-Right | Germany | Deutsche Welle | 27.08.2007 (2007)

Personally, I would see this as a very positive development. I think its good that women awake to the realities alongside the men, and take action and show that these are issues which affect all classes and genders. It has been unfortunately so in the past, that many of the most fanatic multiculturalists have been women.

Do you have any opinions on the role women should or could play within the movement?

[Polina]

I think women have a fairly important part in the movement. Being a female myself, I should think that women have just as good as a chance in politics as men. But I don't, and the reason being, is that the males have dominated politics since as far as the page can turn, and that has led us to believe that only male can be a good political soldier.

As far as the Nationalist movements, I think Nazi Germany made it very clear that women play an important part in a country's ethnicity. With medals being given to any mother that has over a certain number of kinder, campaigns to make more children, etc. But basically, all of those were for population, and so that the Nazis could have more future soldiers to win Europe... and the rest of the world.

Now, I think that it's easier for women to spread propaganda, than men. Because who would expect, a female to be a hard liner? Some might, but not the majority.

[wilpuri]

Originally Posted by Polina

I think women have a fairly important part in the movement. Being a female myself, I should think that women have just as good as a chance in politics as men. But I don't, and the reason being, is that the males have dominated politics since as far as the page can turn, and that has led us to believe that only male can be a good political soldier.

As far as the Nationalist movements, I think Nazi Germany made it very clear that women play an important part in a country's ethnicity. With medals being given to any mother that has over a certain number of kinder, campaigns to make more children, etc. But basically, all of those were for population, and so that the Nazis could have more future soldiers to win Europe... and the rest of the world.

Now, I think that it's easier for women to spread propaganda, than men. Because who would expect, a female to be a hard liner? Some might, but not the majority.

I agree that women in the movement are good for PR.

I hope the trend witnessed in Germany repeats itself elsewhere.

[Bridie]

Any movement that is overwhelmingly dominated by either sex is bound to be imbalanced. People with a limited degree of varying abilities, experiences, view points, methodologies etc are important for the growth and success of every activist movement (not least of all due to the stimulation of self-reflective tendencies). Of course, if the differences between members are too great, the result could be a disruption of in-group cohesion...

[Ferran]

Originally Posted by Polina

Now, I think that it's easier for women to spread propaganda, than men. Because who would expect, a female to be a hard liner? Some might, but not the majority.

That's very right, I would even say most people think that women are "too sweet" to get involved into nationalism (as many people wrongly relate it with supremacism or imperialism, making it thus violent and unfemenine). So well, seeing high numbers of women in nationalist movements is very necessary for its "normalization" IMO, as it could make some people discover a different side of it and realize that what nationalism promotes is, above all, a message of love; love for your people, their (and your) traditions, popular culture, etc. a love of which nationalism is ultimately a political and very legitimate manifestation.

[Lutiferre]

I rarely encounter nationalist women. I had a nationalist girl friend, who was against our current excessive immigration, due to the social problems with Turks and Arabs. The first time she ever let me in on her anti-immigrant sentiment, I was extremely surprised, positively, because many Danish girls are actually sexual fetishists of Turks and Arabs, and find them sexually attractive for whatever reason. Similarly, older (than me) Danish women are pro-immigration cultural fetishists in regard to our many Turkish and Arabian immigrants.

More women in the movement, would be the best thing that could ever happen.

Originally Posted by Ferran

That's very right, I would even say most people think that women are "too sweet" to get involved into nationalism (as many people wrongly relate it with supremacism or imperialism, making it thus violent and unfemenine). So well, seeing high numbers of women in nationalist movements is very necessary for its "normalization" IMO, as it could make some people discover a different side of it and realize that what nationalism promotes is, above all, a message of love; love for your people, their (and your) traditions, popular culture, etc. a love of which nationalism is ultimately a political and very legitimate manifestation.

Exactly. I think some women might actually hesitate to tell people about their nationalist sentiment, in fear of breaking this "females are sweet and loving" bubble or expectation, because nationalism is seen as evil, ignorant and narrow-minded.

[Bridie]

I only just read the first article...

Think of a neo-Nazi and you think of a man with a shaved head, pummeling a foreigner. But that image is outdated, some social researchers say. She may well be a woman -- and a feminist, to boot.

That should increase the credibility of NS then.

One worker at a mobile youth clinic in Ostprignitz, a depressed area of eastern Germany, took a shot at explaining the attraction young women feel toward such right-wing groups.
"The girls want to have fun, they are totally bored -- especially in the countryside," said the worker, who did not give her name. "They are looking for something really attractive. That is the far-right scene."
As part of the far-right, the girls feel strong. They can terrorize people, and have the feeling they are influencing society -- the same thing that draws young men, the worker added.

More propagation of the (patriarchal) myth that women are brain-dead sheep that don't really care about anything of importance like politics, economics, sociology etc. Just another attempt at disempowering women, and now indirectly disempowering right-wing politics via their new found association with supposed brain-dead sheep who are just trying to have a bit of fun.

Personally, I can't see what would so be fun about it. But then, I'm not a female German National Socialist. Perhaps National Socialism is just one big party over there (occasionally interrupted by terrorising people in order to feel strong ).



Really, when one considers the modern emergence of women as a powerful presence in the paid workforce, academia and politics, this throw back to portraying women as brain-dead, passive morons who follow men around in order to feel better about themselves, but never actually have an original idea of their own, is extremely outdated.

If women weren't capable of idealism, a decent standard of intellectualisation or caring about the society they live in then they wouldn't be excelling in these areas as they are today... often to a much higher standard than their male competitors or counterparts are. The proof is in the pudding, as they say.

[Errigal]

Originally Posted by Bridie

...

More propagation of the (patriarchal) myth that women are brain-dead sheep that don't really care about anything of importance like politics, economics, sociology etc. Just another attempt at disempowering women, and now indirectly disempowering right-wing politics via their new found association with supposed brain-dead sheep who are just trying to have a bit of fun.

Personally, I can't see what would so be fun about it. But then, I'm not a female German National Socialist. Perhaps National Socialism is just one big party over there (occasionally interrupted by terrorising people in order to feel strong ).



Really, when one considers the modern emergence of women as a powerful presence in the paid workforce, academia and politics, this throw back to portraying women as brain-dead, passive morons who follow men around in order to feel better about themselves, but never actually have an original idea of their own, is extremely outdated.

If women weren't capable of idealism, a decent standard of intellectualisation or caring about the society they live in then they wouldn't be excelling in these areas as they are today... often to a much higher standard than their male competitors or counterparts are. The proof is in the pudding, as they say.

Whenever I hear the word "disimpowering" I want to go for my revolver.

The reason women are excelling in "intellectualisation" is that the bottom fell out of the free market of ideas. Academia expanded massively in the Sixties and Seventies and now any fraud who talks jargon can claim to be a professor and sell her counterfeit "empowering" trinkets.

Just as in a real flea market, the brash and aggressive women get more attention for the junk they sell than the quiet antiques dealer who has some real treasures.

[Bridie]

Originally Posted by Errigal

The reason women are excelling in "intellectualisation" is that the bottom fell out of the free market of ideas. Academia expanded massively in the Sixties and Seventies and now any fraud who talks jargon can claim to be a professor and sell her counterfeit "empowering" trinkets.

I'm sorry Errigal, but if you think academia was ever a "free market of ideas" and not a some narrowly defined institution governed by a few one-sighted, closed-minded elite scholars on an ego trip then you are on the wrong track.

Originally Posted by Errigal

Just as in a real flea market, the brash and aggressive women get more attention for the junk they sell than the quiet antiques dealer who has some real treasures.

The same could be said for men. In the end, if one wants to be heard, they have to speak. One person's "brash and aggressive" is another person's "brave and fearless", just depends on one's values and one's perspective I suppose.

[M.R.]

Politics are not for women. They should have nationalistic views, but not play some important roles in our movements.

[Errigal]

Originally Posted by Bridie

I'm sorry Errigal, but if you think academia was ever a "free market of ideas" and not a some narrowly defined institution governed by a few one-sighted, closed-minded elite scholars on an ego trip then you are on the wrong track.

Well then I'm happily on the wrong track.

Originally Posted by Bridie

The same could be said for men. In the end, if one wants to be heard, they have to speak. One person's "brash and aggressive" is another person's "brave and fearless", just depends on one's values and one's perspective I suppose.

The problem with women in politics is that they don't seem to understand the concept of compromise.

[Sergius]

Originally Posted by Bridie

That should increase the credibility of NS then.

That says more about NS than feminism.

Originally Posted by Bridie

portraying women as brain-dead, passive morons who follow men around in order to feel better about themselves, but never actually have an original idea of their own, is extremely outdated.

Well, if it's outdated, or extremely outdated even, then it certainly must be wrong.

[Susi]

Originally Posted by M.R.

Politics are not for women. They should have nationalistic views, but not play some important roles in our movements.

I'd say there are important roles outside of politics for women to play (such as in the home as well as some in academia)

[wilpuri]

Originally Posted by M.R.

Politics are not for women. They should have nationalistic views, but not play some important roles in our movements.

Thanks for your opinion. May I ask why they should not play a role in the movement?

[M.R.]

As I said, politics are not for women, so they should play important roles in political movements.

[Martín Zalacaín]

What movement? Do you mean nationalist internet forums?

The only real life female nationalist politician that I know of is the leader of Vlaams Belang. I recently read an interview with her. She seems to be intelligent.