Belgium struggles with political crisis

[Aptrgangr]

Belgium struggles with political crisis


Police urge protesters to move to the other side of the street as they wave Flemish flags
and hold banners in front of the Belvedere Castle, the residence of the Belgian King.
Belgium was mired in a political crisis after Flemish leader Yves Leterme gave up efforts
to form a government with francophone partners who reject his plans for constitutional reform.
(AFP/Belga/Benoit Doppagne)

BRUSSELS (AFP) - Belgium was mired in a political crisis on Friday after Flemish leader Yves Leterme gave up efforts to form a government with francophone partners who reject his plans for constitutional reform.

King Albert II rushed back from holiday in the south of France on Thursday to accept Christian Democrat leader Leterme's resignation as prime minister-in-waiting.
That move brings the political process in Belgium back to square one, two-and-a-half months after general elections on June 10.
Belgium is now in a "state of emergency" Leterme's CDV party president Pieter De Crem said Friday.

"The francophones have collided with the Flemish aim of reforming the state in order to prepare for the future," he said on local radio, describing the situation as "critical".
The demands from Flanders, the richer Dutch speaking north, for more regional powers stoked fears among French-speaking politicians in southern Wallonia that Leterme was looking to break up the country by undermining the federal state.
Leterme's past comments, including that the francophones do not have the intellectual capacity to learn Dutch or that Belgium is just an "accident of history," have done little to soothe those fears.

Nearly everything in Belgium is divided on the basis of language.
Around six million of Belgium's 10.5 million people live in Dutch-speaking Flanders, with 3.5 million in French-speaking Wallonia and one million in the largely francophone Brussels capital region.
Brussels, the capital and third region, is the only place which is officially bilingual, with road signs and administrative documents in French and Dutch. It is also home to the European Union's institutions.

Leterme, whom the king last month named as 'formateur' of the next government, met the monarch late Thursday to tender his resignation. He then said in a statement that he had been unable to form a government which would fulfill the wishes of the electorate.
"Last week... I realised that despite concerted efforts there was an impasse as regards constitutional reforms," Leterme said.
"This afternoon I realised that it was impossible to move forward with an ambitious government programme, the perspective and direction of which the electors clearly defined on June 10," he added.

The king then held lengthy evening talks with Didier Reynders, head of the liberal francophone Mouvement Reformateur.
One of Leterme's main political obstacles, dubbed "Madame Non" in the Flemish press, is party leader Joelle Milquet of the CDH (Democratic Humanist Centre).
She denies suggestions in Flanders that she herself is seeking the prime minister's position, which would be a rarity for a francophone.

"That's not my ambition or objective," she said on RTBF radio on Friday.
Leterme's task was made even more difficult by the need for a two-thirds majority in parliament to push through the constitutional changes sought by the Flemish parties.
The francophone parties accused Leterme of not leading the negotiations with an even hand, seeking to advance the cause of Flanders rather than the country as a whole.
However some francophone commentators warned that the political crisis could only fuel the more radical Flemish calls for increased regional powers, warning that that the issue of state reform should not be shirked.
"Everyone, Flemish and francophones -- has an interest in that dialogue taking place," said the editorial in the francophone Le Soir newspaper.
"If that is not the case then the risk of radicalisation exists," the paper added under the headline "Gordian knot".

As the political impasse continues, the pre-election liberal-socialist government, under Prime Minister Guy Verhofstadt, continues to manage the country's day-to-day affairs but is not empowered to make important policy decisions.

Belgium struggles with political crisis - Yahoo! News

[Waarnemer]

the end of this meaningless nation i live in was never as near as on this moment, belgium is on the point of collapsing and it seems that not even its scandalously overpaid king could care less, while his nation is on the brink of the total edge of existing he spends his time on his scandalously expensive yacht in the south of france

[Menydh]

A chance for France to offer the Walloons a special autonomous status within France? If only France knew about autonomous/federal systems ..

The same goes for The Netherlands. I don't know if the Flemish would like to join in a union with the Dutch.

[Theobald]

Originally Posted by Mynydd

A chance for France to offer the Walloons a special autonomous status within France? If only France knew about autonomous/federal systems ...

As I said in the other thread dealing with Belgium, I don't think the Walloons have any place in Sarkozy's France. He would rather take the Flanders to be honest...

Originally Posted by Mynydd

The same goes for The Netherlands. I don't know if the Flemish would like to join in a union with the Dutch

I don't think they should anyway, at least for now, from an immigration/multiculturalism point of view.

Still, the idea that this anti-national British creation known as Belgium is finally dying can only be a good news.

[Youenn]

Originally Posted by Mynydd

A chance for France to offer the Walloons a special autonomous status within France? If only France knew about autonomous/federal systems ..

If they accept an autonomous province, there are no reason to give autonomy to Brittany, Corsica or even... "french" Flanders ! Just for it, republicans will refuse and Wallons never will accept to lose their autonomy I think so.

Originally Posted by Mynydd

Still, the idea that this anti-national British creation known as Belgium is finally dying can only be a good news.

I don't know if it's a British creation but it's really the copy of the French Republic. Fortunately Wallons weren't the majority, if not all Flemish will be frenchized like the Bruxellians.

[Theobald]

Originally Posted by Youenn

If they accept an autonomous province, there are no reason to give autonomy to Brittany, Corsica or even... "french" Flanders ! Just for it, republicans will refuse and Wallons never will accept to lose their autonomy I think so.

Well, I agree and disagree at the same time. The government was ready to give Corsica an important authonomy status, but the Corsicans refused it through a referendum (a referendum that was, by the way, stigmatized by hardcore jacobinists as "anti-Republican"). I don't think that Sarkozy is so fond of jacobinism. He is a pragmatic politician who thinks like an American, so he would not be basically and ideologically opposed to a federalist/autonomist move.

Also, you have to admit that there is not such a strong will of authonomy in Brittany, as there is in our overseas colonies or Corsica for instance.

Originally Posted by Youenn

I don't know if it's a British creation

The idea of Belgium was strongly supported by British freemasons and thus British governement as a way to counter French ambitions in this area; the Napoleonic era was still a nightmare for many Brits and especially they wanted the port of Antwerp to stay out of French hands. French claims to Belgium only stopped in 1871 with the fall of the Second Empire by the way.

Originally Posted by Youenn

but it's really the copy of the French Republic.

A monarchist version of jacobinism, yes.

[Marcus Marulus]

Originally Posted by Theobald

The idea of Belgium was strongly supported by British freemasons and thus British governement as a way to counter French ambitions in this area; the Napoleonic era was still a nightmare for many Brits and especially they wanted the port of Antwerp to stay out of French hands. French claims to Belgium only stopped in 1871 with the fall of the Second Empire by the way.

Yes, but Belgium, before it became independent state in 1830, had been part of the Kingdom of the Netherlands, although for a short period of time (1815-1830).

[Youenn]

Originally Posted by Theobald

Well, I agree and disagree at the same time. The government was ready to give Corsica an important authonomy status, but the Corsicans refused it through a referendum (a referendum that was, by the way, stigmatized by hardcore jacobinists as "anti-Republican").

50 % of population is not corsican but mainly french and non european migrants, so I would like to see the percentage of real corsicans who voted for the status. And this project of autonomy wasn't important comparing to Scotland or Wales autonomy for exemple. Furthermore, it will be surprising that the republicans propose - even after attentats - an "important" autonomy, their projects are suicidal but they are not stupid.

I don't think that Sarkozy is so fond of jacobinism. He is a pragmatic politician who thinks like an American, so he would not be basically and ideologically opposed to a federalist/autonomist move.

French politic like american don't care of identity, so if they want a federalism, they will make this with artificial region like the "Grande Ouest", that will include the administrativ region of Brittany with the "Pays de la Loire" (who include a part of Brittany) and may be the lower Normandy.
That's already working for the medias like the TV with "France 3 Ouest" and the press "Ouest France", no identity, just geographical, a bullshit.

Also, you have to admit that there is not such a strong will of authonomy in Brittany, as there is in our overseas colonies or Corsica for instance.

Where did I say this ?
If the majority are not independentist, the majority are not against an autonomy (cultural, economical, environmental, academic, fiscal, etc.). This poll confirm this :

Sondages CSA : Les Bretons, les habitants de Loire-Atlantique et la question régionale 5/09/2000

[Cirrus]

Originally Posted by Youenn

50 % of population is not corsican but mainly french and non european migrants, so I would like to see the percentage of real corsicans who voted for the status. And this project of autonomy wasn't important comparing to Scotland or Wales autonomy for exemple. Furthermore, it will be surprising that the republicans propose - even after attentats - an "important" autonomy, their projects are suicidal but they are not stupid.

In fact, some independentists voted "No" to the referendum because of the arrest of Colonna (and also because it was a French State project).

Originally Posted by Youenn

Where did I say this ?

You didn't : "you have to admit that"

Originally Posted by Youenn

If the majority are not independentist, the majority are not against an autonomy (cultural, economical, environmental, academic, fiscal, etc.). This poll confirm this :

Sondages CSA : Les Bretons, les habitants de Loire-Atlantique et la question régionale 5/09/2000

It's already an old poll (7 years ago), and unfortunately it seems that the will of autonomy has declined.

[Zrinski]

I didn't know the situation in Belgoslavia is that serious?!?!

[Youenn]

I've forgotten this thread.

Originally Posted by Cirrus

In fact, some independentists voted "No" to the referendum because of the arrest of Colonna (and also because it was a French State project).

They found and arrested Colona just before the referundum. How random !

Originally Posted by Cirrus

It's already an old poll (7 years ago), and unfortunately it seems that the will of autonomy has declined.

I don't see that making a large change in only 7 years.
Last year I asked five people on the street about this, and three were not against independence. How many people would be for autonomy ? Certainly the same or more.
But contrary to official polls... We asked if the person was Breton or not, some people said "no". But others said "yes". When a person replied "yes", we asked if he was interested in Brittany, and with them, an interest always was the case.

[Marcus Marulus]

Yugoslavia struggled with political crisis for about about two years and a half and then happened...you know what...