Women in the Military: "You're One of Three Things - a Bitch, a Whore or a Dyke"

[Susi]

Originally Posted by OlafurThors

It is a fact that soldiers are trained to wound not kill. The reason is that by wounding men you take out two men not just one, the other will stop to help the one who got shot.

You think so? If one's friend/comdrade has just been shot at, I think one would probably want some sort of vengeance. Maybe that's just my thinking..

It was a joke, a little humor is always healthy.

Kind of like how I could say all men are rude perverts who only care how a woman looks and not about what she has to say, right? It's a joke about you not replying to my post.

Originally Posted by Strengthandhonour

No one here doubts the ability of a woman to combat.

I would agree with this.

Also, the most important female warrior of all times that comes to mind for me is Boudica..and we all know how she ended up.

Well isn't it how everyone ends up?

Originally Posted by OlafurThors

Why? How? When? Where? What?
Do you have proof of such claims?
Some might say that t is more a social order rather than a natural one...

You ignored my post, you silly goose.

Look at a man. How is he built? He is built so that he will succeed hunting and in battle. Men are naturally stronger than women, wouldn't you agree?

Look at a woman. How is she built? She is built for nurturing (you may not know this but breasts are actually for feeding babies. ).

I think that you think of women as soft and nice and emotional, the fact is that you cannot a say all women are this way or that all men are that way.

Yes, some men want to be women and some women want to be men.

No, but seriously. I know Iceland has a small population... but how many women who have always wanted to be in the army have you met there? How many unemotional women have you met? How many men have you met that show incredible amounts of emotion? usw.

Yes, there are people who want to join the army, like my friend (who is being nicer to me, by the way). But this is not the majority.

But if we look at the original post, many female soldiers are likely to be sexually assaulted by her comrades. Is this really want you want for women?

[Carnyx]

Originally Posted by OlafurThors

It is a fact that soldiers are trained to wound not kill. The reason is that by wounding men you take out two men not just one, the other will stop to help the one who got shot.

Weapons are made to wound, not to give death and war is Peace.

Have you noticed how Democracy always comes along with a well done clean war?

Historically:
Israel

You might be interested in reading the whole truth about women and Tsahal.

Soviet Union

When they were being invaded, I would assume not in offensives ; a clear tumultus case. One can ask children as young as teenagers and elders to fight in such a desesperate situation.

Aztec

Those who lost their Empire against a few hundreds of men? Who said so anyway? Another feminist piece of propaganda.

Germanic Tribes B.C.

Those lombards (long beards) may have taken androgens after JC finaly.

And many more

Current:

USA

Where's this article about raped female soldiers again?

Norway
Sweden
Belgium
UK
Germany

Some one clean armies, they are invited to our national Day on July 14th, btw. A very nice procession to come with lots of stunts in the air and shiny new uniforms. Hopefully, they put the women in the foreground to let any dummies admire how good is gender equality in the army. "Parity" as they say here.

Russia

And soon I fear they shall let their women wear the pants...

China

I wouldn't have thought a billion and more inhabitants country was in any need of women to join its army.

Iran

What? Iran goes Feministan? Combat Hidjab, come one...

And many more

Give us exemples of armies from non- (pseudo)"Democratic" egalitarian nations.

Originally Posted by Strengthandhonour

ah yes the amazons. I don't deny they were fine warriors.

A romantic myth at best illustrated by as rare as episodical events.

Originally Posted by Susi

I am going to prove this right now. (but not that last bit )

Try to convince them instead.

[Aptrgangr]

Originally Posted by Mynydd

What you are posting there are women in uniform.

My choice of pics in reference to the thread's title.

Originally Posted by Mynydd

Not that wearing a uniform makes one a warrior..

That's very true. That's why I did not post some recruits but professionals.

Originally Posted by Mynydd

Also, have you noticed how clean all the uniforms are and how shiny the boots?

Well, women are known for cleanlyless, no? Anyway, these pictures were not taken in a combat zone, and in barracks there is a strict rule of having clean and proper uniforms, I do not need to tell you this.

Originally Posted by Carnyx

Weapons are made to wound, not to give death and war is Peace.

It's ridiculous as it sounds, but rifles must have muzzle breaks in order not to cause lethal wounds (except by a direct head shot etc.)

Originally Posted by Carnyx

Where's this article about raped female soldiers again?

It is not the women's fault when they get raped. Criminal behaviour is encouraged by the laissez-faire handling of this problem.

Originally Posted by Carnyx

What? Iran goes Feministan? Combat Hidjab, come one...
Give us exemples of armies from non- (pseudo)"Democratic" egalitarian nations.

No Islamic country does without female soldiers resp. a female militia. All guerilla/partisan armies recruit women, and they are anything but without success, German soldiers had to learn how precisely female Red army as well as Red partisan snipers shot. They were famously know for their precision. US armed forces also had to suffer big casualties in Vietnam due to female Viet-Cong snipers.

In general I noticed a strong refusal of women in military around here. I think when attacked it is good to have some additional firepower. I am well aware it is against the flag etiquette and the warrior's code of conduct, but these rules are unnecessary luxury, especially in nowadays' battles. Sounds harsh, but it is the truth. I just give an example of today's small arms urban every-day-warfare: one time I almost was attacked by a gang of immigrant girls that roamed the tram, they attacked other males physically but they did not attack me, would they have done so either them or me would have ended up as mincemeat (and no, I did not help those pathetic others, either one fights for himself or perishes).
The problem of to day is the de-masculization of man. We have to work on this problem urgently, as well as we have to make sure women can defend themselves.

[M.R.]

Originally Posted by OlafurThors

Israel
Soviet Union
Aztec
Germanic Tribes B.C.
And many more

Ok, how many women were there in their army and did they play significant role or were there just few women maybe who didn't have much importance?

Also, from the historical armies you listed, I'm not fascinated by neither of those armies.

Israel? You mean Israel army from times of the Bible and that? They had women in their ranks? I never heard about that.

Soviet Union... I don't doubt that Red Army was good, but I haven't seen any woman there yet.

Aztecs.. lol, we know what happened when Spaniards came.

Germanic tribes.. They weren't what you can call a great historical army. Don't get me wrong, I don't doubt they had courage and they also had some victories on their terrain in Germania agains Romans, but they were absolutely not an organized army like Roman or ancient Macedonian army for example.

[Carnyx]

Originally Posted by Aptrgangr

Is ridiculous as it sounds, but rifles must have muzzle breaks in order not to cause lethal wounds (except by a direct head shot etc.)

Yes it is, seems too idealistic to be real. And what do tanks and air plane fighters are to? Additional deco material?

It is not the women's fault when they get raped. Criminal behaviour is encouraged by the laissez-faire handling of this problem.

And how would you avoid promiscuity so? Perhaps they ought to have a seperate dormitory as well as toilets and so on battle fields... Seriously I'll be frank, I can't imagine a woman -be it a "soldier" or a civilian- taking for a pee or whatever intimous in front of men.

No Islamic country does without female soldiers resp. a female militia.

What would Allah do? Well, I'm well aware there has been females in the French resistance eg, on the ground I'm not sure though exceptions can be observed anywhere.

All guerilla/partisan armies recruit women, and they are anything but without success,

We need more tomboys then.

German soldiers had to learn how precisely female Red army as well as Red partisan snipers shot. They were famously know for their precision. US armed forces also had to suffer big casualties in Vietnam due to female Viet-Cong snipers.

Precision... But was their feminity the cause of it? I hardly believe it. Otherwise there would have been more of them, quite logically. Most likely they caught attention because 1) they as rare recruits (ie females) 2) happened to made a good job. Whenever one sees a damn good soldier, you don't hear around: "hey it's a man and he's good!" but when it's a woman you can hear: "it's a woman". Sounds like female supremacy to me.

Anyway as it's impossible to compare a contemporary western influenced feminist woman with an Eastern woman it's even more difficult to do so with a 40's one. They didn't live the same life condition, they would cope with hard sh*tty life conditions better than our western women IMO. The same goes with the men, btw. It's natural selection on a daily basis there.

In general I noticed a strong refusal of women in military around here.

This comes from the latitud.

I think when attacked it is good to have some additional firepower.

The biggest battle field nowadays is not on our streets but in the maternity. Seems like we are losing the battle. While immigrants make children to their women we open them our barracks' door... We are

The problem of to day is the de-masculization of man. We have to work on this problem urgently, as well as we have to make sure women can defend themselves.

Yes, that and the masculization of women.

[Menydh]

Aptrgangr, I've argued what is the problem with accepting women in the military in combat units here. You are defending the physical possibility, which is arguable depending on each particular case. But it is not the issue here.

It is far complex than the simple "if they can and they want, they should". Accepting that is easy and it doesn't look like a problem at first sight.

But consider that what is being accepted is also a change in gender roles. The confusion of gender roles is one of the main things that have us all in the mess that we are today..

We are commenting this problem almost on a daily basis, as part of the news that we post here:

The nations of Europe are ageing and dying out because people don't have enough children. And people don't have enough children because the model of the traditional family has been broken and women won't have children and take care of them because they are a burden to their professional careers.

That adds up to other problems like that this society makes it very hard (if not impossible) for a man to be able to work and provide for a family. In part provoked by the Liberal economic policies, in part provoked by the consumist mentality that has been implanted on people.

Immigrants, on the other hand, have those children that we are not having. Especially Muslim immigrants, they maintain through their attachment to their Islamic religion, a model of a traditional family where their women are at home raising their children. They don't pursue careers outside their traditional role as wives and mothers. Their idea of gender roles is not twisted like ours.

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by Aptrgangr

When you say the woman's place is home and kitchen

"home and kitchen" makes it sound as an enclosing of women in a reduced life. That's deceitful.

Running a house and raising a family properly is a fulfilling life that takes ideally two, a man and a woman, to do it. But the roles must not be twisted.

then you have to consider limiting the access to labour market for women. Fact is many women, like men, do not want to have children anyway - and there are many reasons for it - but since it is like that I do not see a problem to let a woman join military instead of practicing a bureau job.

The reasons why people don't want to have children have been largely discussed already, and I have mentioned some of the most important in my previous post.

Whatever it takes. First things must be first. What's the point in having women joining an army to defend a nation that is on the brink of extinction, not because of external hostile military forces but precisely because women are in the army or pursuing the male role somewhere else instead of taking care of the continuity of that nation through raising children?

I am aware most women are not able to cope physically with men, nevertheless there are well trained women that can match with any of their male counterparts, like this female F-16 pilot from Belgium.

As I've said, the physical (or even technical) part is only a matter of possibilities. Are they [physically or technically] able to do it? Surely some will be more able than others, and even some of them more able than some men.

But that issue is small if compared to the effects of confusing gender roles in a society.

[dime]

Originally Posted by Leland Gaunt

I don't think that woman in army is a good idea. Women should raise their children, not run with guns.

who said anything about guns
they should be nurses or doctors or secretaries or even drivers(although i hope when i serve my time i dont have a woman driving me)

[Vincent]

Originally Posted by dime

who said anything about guns
they should be nurses or doctors or secretaries or even drivers(although i hope when i serve my time i dont have a woman driving me)

I think they are better drivers. Or at least, they are more careful on the road. Or am I wrong?

[Susi]

I can't drive.

But my brother and father drive much more carelessly than my mother... if that has anything to do with it?

[OlafurThors]

Originally Posted by Susi

Kind of like how I could say all men are rude perverts who only care how a woman looks and not about what she has to say, right? It's a joke about you not replying to my post.

Look at a woman. How is she built? She is built for nurturing (you may not know this but breasts are actually for feeding babies. ).

Yes, some men want to be women and some women want to be men.

No, but seriously. I know Iceland has a small population... but how many women who have always wanted to be in the army have you met there? How many unemotional women have you met? How many men have you met that show incredible amounts of emotion? usw.

Yes, there are people who want to join the army, like my friend (who is being nicer to me, by the way). But this is not the majority.

But if we look at the original post, many female soldiers are likely to be sexually assaulted by her comrades. Is this really want you want for women?

Sorry for not replying to your post....

There are no women in the Icelandic Army, because we don't have armed forces. I did however live in Norway for several years, I know personally some women that would like to join the army. At the same time 7-10% of the Norwegian armed forces are female, and soon compulsory military service will be for all Norwegians not just men.

There are a lot of guys in the armed forces of Norway, that actually don't want to be there so whether people want to be there or not doesn't really matter, the whole issue is about our duty to protect and serve our nations.

I don'' want women or men to be sexually assaulted anytime by anyone. If a man is sexually assaulted doesn't mean that all young horny men should be taken out of the military. If a woman is assaulted there is something wrong with the men, not the woman. These men should be treated as criminals jailed and "castrated" for their crime.

However the Israelis create female and male squads, and organize the armed forces so that all personell is used in the most productive way. But we are not so much discussing organization in the armed forces as the principle of women in the army.

Women should be free to participate and serve their nation proudly, how it is organized I'm not so concerned about.

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by Hohenheim

I think they are better drivers. Or at least, they are more careful on the road. Or am I wrong?

Very wrong.