Battle of Nicopolis, 25 September 1396

[Alkman]

Originally Posted by Pandur

No, his father was an Albanian nobleman, Gjon Kastrioti (Giovanni Castriota), lord of Middle Albania

Grandfather of Georgios Kastriotis was Konstantinos Kastriotis,ruler of Imathia kai Kastoria in South Macedonia.This is where his family really originated.One of his sons,Ioannis,moved to Kruja (middle Albania)after being given the title of "Authentis" (Byzantine hegemon) of the region.He married Serbian princess Voisava from Polog and one of their sons was Georgios.

[Zvonimir]

Originally Posted by Archangelos

Serbs are partially of Illyrian descedent.

Skanderbeg knew that because he had results of genetic tests or what?

Your logic is realy flawless.

[White Falcon]

Cut the crap, he considered himself to be Albanian , he used red Albanian flag with black 2 headed eagle,
and whats important I'we never heard neither Greeks or Serbs to claim that he was their nationalist figure , only Albanians do,
square in Rome which is called Square Albania has Skanderbeg monument.

[Archangelos]

How could he consider himself a nationality that wasnt created yet? He didnt use the red albanian flag, but rather the Byzantine Two-headed eagle on a field of blood(red), which Albanians adopted, after the fact, as their flag, when their nation was created by the world powers.

Zvonimir, what are you talking about? Stop talking out of your ass, listen to what you and your buddy are saying, where do you come up with the stuff you post? Then again you are Pandur's little 'brothers' so it explains everything

This thread was created to bash Serbs as Turk Lovers, and here you are showing us you are Albanian and Bosnian Muslim lovers....

[EnricoI]

Originally Posted by Pandur

The reason why the Turks weren't expelled out of Europe.

When also the Americans will be expelled from Europe?

[Zrinski]

Originally Posted by Zvonimir

Since when Serbs are Illyrians?

Illyrians were people which lived in South-Central/South-East Europe. They were not racially nor even linguistically homogenous people but rather composition of people's that lived in this area. Illyrian is a name given by early Greeks and Romans for all people that lived here. Serbs, Croats and all other South Slavic nations that exist today assimilated and in fact are mostly made of these people.

During Austrian Monarchy pan-slavist in this area were very aware of that fact and called their south-slavic movment Illyrian movement. When Austrians(Habsburgs) saw the danger in this(because it threatened to unite all South Slavs against them) they started spreading propaganda of some fantasy ancient powerful nation of Illyrians that were wiped out by Slavs and that some of them retreated south and became Albanians. From genetic studies we know for a fact that this is not true.

In short Illyrian means South-Slavic(Slovens, Croats, Serbs)

[Zrinski]

Petr it is proved already by genetics that Bosniaks are pure as any other European. They are closest to us Croats which proves what we already knew - Bosniaks are islamized Croats.

It's only their muslim fate that is non-european....are you ready to discard and give up on European people just because they are of some other fate that will be discarded in couple of hundreds of years from now?

I think not...so please do not talk gibberish.

And btw. Serbs allied themselves equally with Bosniaks during the recent war as much as Croats. There is a document recently that got out which proves how they at one point cooperated against Croats in Bosnia-Herzegovina.

[Vojvoda]

Originally Posted by Pandur

Serbs gained permanent benefits inside the Ottoman empire because of Sultans grand Vezir
Mehmed Pasha Sokolovic (a Serb who led the Ottoman army on Vienna), and his brother - founder of Serbian Orthodox church. Serbian Pashaluk developed in peace.

He was a Serb? But I thought Bosnian Muslims were your 'blood brothers'

Wow, them couple of hundred Serb mercenaries must have been very tough beating back a 30000 strong army

[Zrinski]

Originally Posted by Vožd

He was a Serb? But I thought Bosnian Muslims were your 'blood brothers'

Sokolovic was not Bosnian Muslim. He was a Serb from Serbia taken from his parents and trained among Janissary soldiers.

[Vojvoda]

Originally Posted by Zrinski

Sokolovic was not Bosnian Muslim. He was a Serb from Serbia taken from his parents and trained among Janissary soldiers.

"I think not.... so please do not talk gibberish"- Zrinski

"Among the most famous of these Bosnian converts was Mehmed Pasha Sokolovic (1505-1579)"

http://www.haverford.edu/relg/sells/killing.html


I feel my IQ dropping after reading some of these posts

[Zrinski]

Again - Sokolovic was not Bosnian Muslim. The man was from Sanjak. Those and Bosnian Muslims are two different things.

And btw. I don't think your IQ dropping has anything to do with this thread.

[Vojvoda]

Originally Posted by Zrinski

Again - Sokolovic was not Bosnian Muslim. The man was from Sanjak.

Get your facts straight.He was from south-east Bosnia, Visegrad

[Alkman]

Originally Posted by White Falcon

Cut the crap, he considered himself to be Albanian

He considered himself an "Epirote Prince".He was the "Greek ruler of Kruja" for Europeans and urks of his time.

Originally Posted by White Falcon

He used red Albanian flag with black 2 headed eagle

No,he used a red byzantine flag with 2 black headed eagle that was later adopted as official from the Albanian state,500 years after the death of Kastriotis.You need to clear thing up a little

Originally Posted by White Falcon

And whats important I'we never heard neither Greeks or Serbs to claim that he was their nationalist figure

Then you have ear hearing problems.Not that it is important what anyone claims.

Originally Posted by White Falcon

only Albanians do,.

Albanians also claim Pyrrus,Alexander,Illyrians,Ancient Epirotes and half of Slav heroes.

Originally Posted by White Falcon

square in Rome which is called Square Albania has Skanderbeg monument.

So?

[Zvonimir]

Originally Posted by Archangelos

Zvonimir, what are you talking about? Stop talking out of your ass, listen to what you and your buddy are saying, where do you come up with the stuff you post? Then again you are Pandur's little 'brothers' so it explains everything

Look...
Serbs through all their history represented themselves as Slavs so if Skanderbeg considered himself as Illyrian than there is no way that he was Serb.
It really isn't hard to comprehend, isn't it?

Zrinksi, Illyrian movement begane in 19th centruy while Skanderbeg lived in 15th century.

[Zrinski]

Originally Posted by Vožd

Get your facts straight.He was from south-east Bosnia, Visegrad

South-east Bosnia? You mean Zahumlje? Thats not Bosnia mate.

[Vojvoda]

Originally Posted by Zrinski

You mean Zahumlje?

I didn't know western Hecegovina was actually called south-east Bosnia

[White Falcon]

Originally Posted by Archangelos

How could he consider himself a nationality that wasnt created yet?

Yeah right , wasnt created , it instantly reminds me on similar claims regarding Croats.
We all agree that modern term of nation differs from period we are talking.
As for Albanians , if I remember correctly even Tsar Dusan claimed that he
is able to distinguish Serb , Albanian and Vlach from each other.

Originally Posted by Archangelos

He didnt use the red albanian flag, but rather the Byzantine Two-headed eagle on a field of blood(red), which Albanians adopted, after the fact, as their flag, when their nation was created by the world powers.

If they adopted it , it is theirs,
and save me please from ZOG , NWO , world powers fairy tales.

[White Falcon]

Originally Posted by Alkman

He considered himself an "Epirote Prince".He was the "Greek ruler of Kruja" for Europeans and urks of his time.

And considered him self to be Albanian.

Originally Posted by Alkman

No,he used a red byzantine flag with 2 black headed eagle that was later adopted as official from the Albanian state,500 years after the death of Kastriotis.You need to clear thing up a little

So it is Croatian official flag created in 1990 , and this does not diminish our right to use it
as it is composed from our historical coat of arms which our ancestors used.

Originally Posted by Alkman

Then you have ear hearing problems.Not that it is important what anyone claims.
Albanians also claim Pyrrus,Alexander,Illyrians,Ancient Epirotes and half of Slav heroes.

What relevance this has? How this changes fact that Skenderbeg was Albanian?
They can claim Albanians are from Mars as well , it doesnt change Skenderbegs ethnicity.

Originally Posted by Alkman

So?

What so? Now we are going to ignore this important fact how most of world perceives Skanderbeg because it doesnt fit you.