EU aims to criminalise Holocaust denial

[Marcus Marulus]

EU aims to criminalise Holocaust denial

By Tobias Buck in Brussels

Published: April 17 2007 19:56 | Last updated: April 17 2007 19:56

Laws that make denying or trivialising the Holocaust a criminal offence punishable by jail sentences will be introduced across the European Union, according to a proposal expecting to win backing from ministers Thursday.
Offenders will face up to three years in jail under the proposed legislation, which will also apply to inciting violence against ethnic, religious or national groups.
Diplomats in Brussels voiced confidence on Tuesday that the controversial plan, which has been the subject of heated debate for six years, will be endorsed by member states. However, the Baltic countries and Poland are still holding out for an inclusion of “Stalinist crimes” alongside the Holocaust in the text – a move that is being resisted by the majority of other EU countries.
The latest draft, seen by the Financial Times, will make it mandatory for all Union member states to punish public incitement “to violence or hatred directed against a group of persons or a member of such a group defined by reference to race, colour, religion, descent or national or ethnic origin”.
They will also have to criminalise “publicly condoning, denying or grossly trivialising crimes of genocide, crimes against humanity and war crimes” when such statements incite hatred or violence against minorities.
Diplomats stressed the provision had been carefully worded to include only denial of the Holocaust – the Nazi mass murder of Jews during the second world war – and the genocide in Rwanda in 1994.
They also stressed that the wording was designed to avoid criminalising comical plays or films about the Holocaust such as the Italian comedian Roberto Benigni’s prize-winning Life is Beautiful . The text expressly upholds countries’ constitutional traditions relating to the freedom of expression.
Holocaust denial is already a criminal offence in several European countries, including Germany and Austria. It is not a specific crime in Britain, though UK officials said it could already be tackled under existing legislation.
In an attempt to assuage Turkish fears, several EU diplomats said the provisions would not penalise the denial of mass killing of Armenians by Ottoman troops in the aftermath of the 1915 collapse of the Ottoman empire. Turkey strongly rejects claims that this episode amounted to genocide.
The proposal draws what is likely to be a controversial distinction between inciting violence against racial or ethnic groups and against religious groups. Attacks against Muslims, Jews or other faiths will only be penalised if they go on to incite violence against ethnic or racial groups, the draft text states.

[source]

[Kernunnos]

The aim is to criminalize any criticism of immigrants as ethnic groups.

It is not a case if they refuse to silence communist deniers of comunist genocides.

This is not a legislation made to protect minorities.

This is aimed at silencing right wing parties and personalities acting against immigration.

Let's prepare to work undercover, as samizdat writers.

Censhorship didn't prevent communism to spread, as it didn't stop revolutionary ideas to circlate in France.

We just need to be quick.

[Gladstone]

Originally Posted by Breha

The aim is to criminalize any criticism of immigrants as ethnic groups...This is not a legislation made to protect minorities.

Yes, that's exactly so.

Those promoting this law see the 'immigrants'...as well as the native peoples of Europe for that matter...as simply animals fit only to be exploited economically by them. The laws are therefore not ultimately about protecting people but rather about protecting the incredible profits to be had from exploiting these persons as cheap labor, which applying the 'law of supply and demand' to people is typically procured by encouraging mass uncontrolled immigration. It is no matter to those desiring these laws that such a policy is very socially destructive to most all concerned. Typically, due to wealth and or position, they are the last to feel it, and after all, the former US Treasurer and slave speculator Robert Walker did effectively calculate cheap labor having a 400% superior rate of profitability over chattel slavery. So then from their vantage, why shouldn't they prey on these often desperate souls and help themselves to this great wealth?

The proponents of these laws want to make sure that nothing, not even their own people nor humanity itself, gets in the way of them getting at these profits.

[Menydh]

Didn't someone post a new article which said that Germany wanted to impose its law against Holocaust denial to all EU countries, but this was rejected?

I've searched for that article but I haven't found it. Anyway, this other is somehow related in that it works in similar directions:

Germany Launches EU Initiative to Tackle Right-Wing Extremism

[Marcus Marulus]

Originally Posted by Mynydd

Didn't someone post a new article which said that Germany wanted to impose its law against Holocaust denial to all EU countries, but this was rejected?

I've searched for that article but I haven't found it. Anyway, this other is somehow related in that it works in similar directions:

Germany Launches EU Initiative to Tackle Right-Wing Extremism

Yes, it seems this bill is part of the larger scheme to fight "racism and xenophobia". Banning Holocaust denial all across Europe is only a part of the proposal of law that is being discussed these days in the so-called European parliament. Here's the pdf version of it (it sounds scary):

http://timworstall.typepad.com/timwo..._34_latest.pdf

[Marcus Marulus]

Comment by Brussels Journal:

Stop This Awful Totalitarian EU Legislation | The Brussels Journal

[Waarnemer]

when opinion becomes crime democracy will be an illusion

[Kernunnos]

Originally Posted by Waarnemer

when opinion becomes crime democracy will be an illusion

It is already: Zundel and Irving know it well, regardless of the absurdity of their attempt to exhonerate Hitler from his responsabilities they should not be persecuted for their opinions.

Our democracies are slowly evolving into orwellianisms and many comon folks even are happy of it.

Actually average people are often useless whatever value one tries to defend, they never rebel as long as they are not brought to famine ad despair, and even in such cases they can be brutal with the innocents and oblivious to the real culprits.

Popolo bue, so goes the italian saying, the people is an ox, and behaves as such.

[Kernunnos]

Originally Posted by Gladstone

Yes, that's exactly so.

Those promoting this law see the 'immigrants'...as well as the native peoples of Europe for that matter...as simply animals fit only to be exploited economically by them. The laws are therefore not ultimately about protecting people but rather about protecting the incredible profits to be had from exploiting these persons as cheap labor, which applying the 'law of supply and demand' to people is typically procured by encouraging mass uncontrolled immigration. It is no matter to those desiring these laws that such a policy is very socially destructive to most all concerned. Typically, due to wealth and or position, they are the last to feel it, and after all, the former US Treasurer and slave speculator Robert Walker did effectively calculate cheap labor having a 400% superior rate of profitability over chattel slavery. So then from their vantage, why shouldn't they prey on these often desperate souls and help themselves to this great wealth?

The proponents of these laws want to make sure that nothing, not even their own people nor humanity itself, gets in the way of them getting at these profits.

It is the triumph of the homo hoeconomicus of the illuminism: mankind turned into quality cattle.

[Ferran]

Laws that make denying or trivialising the Holocaust a criminal offence punishable by jail sentences will be introduced across the European Union, according to a proposal expecting to win backing from ministers Thursday.

It's not the "denial" or "trivialization" of the so called Holocaust what some people hate, but the possibility of losing it as what it currently is, a very powerful political coaction tool to defend the advance of their interests in the Middle East under the accusation of anti-Semitism if someone dares to voice some logical and inoffensive criticism of them. When reality is that they are the people who in first place should be labeled as such, as anti-Semites, and not without reason.

I mean, it's a fact that the vast majority of Jews who died in WWII (whichever the number was, I won't enter the number's game) were Orthodox Jews. Which implies that they opposed Zionism, so imagine what would be their disgust to know that their death has been used for the benefit of a minority who did not love them as much as people think, as the truth is that it was Zionists and sympatizing people the ones who blocked some routes for Jews to leave Nazi Europe or sank a ship with Jewish refugees claiming that they just commited suicide in act of protest.

But talking of the misusing of historical (or not so historical) events with political purposes, we could also mention the bombing of Gernika, which has been for decades -and still is- a very important propagandistic tool for anti-Francoist activists, although not for what the bombing actually was according to facts, but rather for what they would have liked it to be. Fortunately revisionism is not banned for that issue, so many historians had been able to demonstrate that what some people wanted was very far from historical truth, as Arjuna Durden very well explained here.

So well, who knows if other people were interested in the "Jewish Holocaust" to be much bigger too? Although if it's true that certain individuals were interested to claim as much victims as posible, why no one showed interest in making "martyrs" of the considerably higher number of Jewish deaths in pre-WWII Soviet Union? Why had these Jews to be forgotten? Uhm, I suppose that Communism had still to play an important role in the asocial movements of the 50's-70's, so satanizing it would have been indeed undesirable for the goals of some, don't you think?

[Gladstone]

Originally Posted by Breha

It is the triumph of the homo hoeconomicus of the illuminism: mankind turned into quality cattle.

There are animal trainers who use food rather than whips and or chairs to control animals. It would seem the multi-culturalists are not dissimilar, but instead of food use money, ie the control of the economic/money system. 'Good' behaviour in their eyes is rewarded with one's country being made into a 'tiger' economy while 'bad' behaviour is rewarded with sanctions. However, as has been seen, what the multi-cultists see as good is in reality bad for a people, as well as bad for humanity as a whole.

It's why its important for every people, if they are to be free, to control their own money system and media, something of which the multi-culturalists absurdly describe as being in a state of 'hate'. It also explains why the multi-culturalists fight that so much...particularly so as to maintain control of the economic/financial system which is the ultimate source of the cults' power.

[Kernunnos]

Originally Posted by Gladstone

There are animal trainers who use food rather than whips and or chairs to control animals. It would seem the multi-culturalists are not dissimilar, but instead of food use money, ie the control of the economic/money system. 'Good' behaviour in their eyes is rewarded with one's country being made into a 'tiger' economy while 'bad' behaviour is rewarded with sanctions. However, as has been seen, what the multi-cultists see as good is in reality bad for a people, as well as bad for humanity as a whole.

It's why its important for every people, if they are to be free, to control their own money system and media, something of which the multi-culturalists absurdly describe as being in a state of 'hate'. It also explains why the multi-culturalists fight that so much...particularly so as to maintain control of the economic/financial system which is the ultimate source of the cults' power.

Actually they dare say that democracy is the prduct of liberism and both are indispensable to economic growth.

The ideological scam is so brazen that even average readers of our domesticaed media should realize that strongly nationalistic dictatorship or democracies like China and Russia can grow better than the neoconized democracies.

What is true is that liberal democracies are just too smart to control people directly, the puppeteers own the medias and media indoctrination is so soft that average people never realize it.

How many people around us will swear for the "independce" of newspapers whose articles reveal to the politics and economics experts a lot of hidden bias towards the interest of the newspaper' s owners?

The softness of such indoctrination and the apparent level of freedom is our greates obstacle, actually if it wasn't for the net we would have a lot of difficulties at publishing our ideas: non mainstream publishing houses reach for a meaningless part of the populace, since the great distribution cuts them intentionally off the big market.

Again the great distribution is in the hands of the same forces owning other medias.

It is a sad situation that of the slaves who cannot feel chains that are almost invisible since they are mostly built in their minds in years of sweet deception: Ulysses is the prisoners of the Syrens again, and he is te first wishing tor emain in chains.

[Gladstone]

Originally Posted by Breha

...What is true is that liberal democracies are just too smart to control people directly, the puppeteers own the medias and media indoctrination is so soft that average people never realize it.

How many people around us will swear for the "independce" of newspapers whose articles reveal to the politics and economics experts a lot of hidden bias towards the interest of the newspaper' s owners?

The softness of such indoctrination and the apparent level of freedom is our greates obstacle...

It is all quite insidious indeed.

[Crvena zvezda]

The worst is that the EU wants to impose similar legislation on non-EU member states. EU funded groups in serbia have been critical of Serbia for the following reasons:
- Serbia has not passed legislation criminalize doubting Bosniak claims regarding "alledged" crimes committed during the war. Notable examples include saying that the Muslim allegations of "mass rapes" are false (proven to be lies), claims regarding alledged concentration camps (proven to be lies), claims regarding srebrenica (proven to be lies) and claims regarding war dead numbers (proven to be lies, Bosniaks claimed that 250,000+ dead of which 90% Bosniak, figures now showe that at most 100,000 died and that Muslims make some 55% of dead and that a large portion of those who died were from intra-muslim violence).
- EU has criticized Serbia for not teahcing enought regarding the holocaust and for paiting a positive picture of fascist Italy in WWII in some history books.
- EU has criticized Serba for teaching in some history books that the Turks committed genocides against all peoples ion the Balkans. Claiming that this is meant to cause anti-Muslim opinions.