Germany top job destination for Polish workers

[newenstad]

Let´s start in the early years. Once there was a man called Julius Caesar. He liked maps. All regions northern the Danube and on the eastern side of the Rhine were called GERMANIA MAGNA at this time. After some years of Germanic tribes who had a rather good life some tribes like the Vistulans, Lendians, Obodrites,... and of course the Polanes founded some small states (~850 ad). The Bohemians became the dukes and then King Otto I. (oh he is King of the Germans and the first Holy Roman Emperor) needed someone to fight against the Slavs from the East. There was a man (his name was Miezko I.) who had married a catholic daughter of a bohamian duke and he was also the leader of "usque Varta fluvium". In the year 966 ad King Otto the Great affirmed the ducal title and this was the start of the "Piast Dynasty".

In the 13th century Poland became diffused in some smalles states and so it was quite easy for the Mongols and some other tribes from "Poland" to raise havoc. But there were some glorious warriors called the "Teutonic Order" and they fought against them and founded their own state. When the whole "Holy European Army" fought in the East the Jews settled down in Poland.
With a little bit help of the Hungarians Przemysl II was crowned in the year 1295 ad as the "King of Poland".
The Teutonics fought against the Polish crown and as a result of many wars the Monastic State of Teutonic Order had been reduced to a small unit and so the Jagiellons had the main power. This was the time of the Poland-Lithunia Kingdom (I think that´s the time of bocian ). Then there were struggles between the Non-Catholic parts and Poland, Russia and Poland, Sweden and Poland,....

In the year 1683 Jan Sobieski fought against the Turks in the "Battle of Vienna" which was the end of the "Islamic Invasion" at that time (everybody knows what I mean). Then it was the time of Prussia, Russia and the Austrian Empire thought that it would be nice to enlarge their empires - thought and done and in 1795 there was no Poland-Lithunia on the European map.

After the Napoleon wars and the Congress of Vienna a new (small) Poland (Congress Poland) was rebuildt but only for nearly 16 years (major power was the Tsar). In 1830 there was the "November Revolution" and Poland lost the limited autonomy in 1831.

Then in 1916 the "Regency Kingdom of Poland" was founded by the Austrian and German emperors to have more people for an army against Russia. On November 11th, 1918 they (Woodrow Wilson and gang) created a state which didn´t exist for more than 123 years and they named their idea Point 13. But there was one city that don´t want to be in the "point 13 land". The name of the town was Danzig and 21 years later more cities became German (all towns till the Pisa-Narew-Bug-San-Line). 1941 all cities were German.

After the WW II Poland was under the occupation of the Soviet Union and when Lech Walesa was elected in December 1990 it was the end of communism in Poland. In 2004 Poland joined the EU.


So what was the thing about the "historic Polish lands"?

[Alfred P.]

A similar funny story can be told about the strange entity called "Germany".
But still - bravo for newenstad for this short but convincing History of Point 13.(for those who don´t know history of Poland or don´t care).


The atmosphere in this thread has become palpably tense. And no wonder. The neighborhood has been and is difficult. There are grievances on both sides. Claims abound (though not dating 2000 years ago as in some other places). The past cannot easily be undone. New ethnic cleansing? Any other ideas? Don´t we have more pressing common problems than reminding ourselves of the horrors and mistakes of the past?

One point of the History I would like to rewrite, though. Not because the most important but most recent and pregnant in repercussions till this day:
Hitler wanted "just an ex-territorial corridor through Corridor" in order to create contact with the poor and backward East Prussia. At the same time, he and Speer have been entertaining each other with models of "Germania" - the new capital of the world(or Europe at least - whatever) and Goering was playing his toy trains and toy bombers in Carinhall. But who says there have ever been problems transporting goods to and from E. Prussia? There were none.
This was Hitler´s negotiating style: if you don´t give me what I want, I´ll just invade you. Let´s talk!

Who wonders that the Poles were not interested in this kind of negotiations? Especially just 20 years after regaining their own country and statehood?
Poland certainly did not make any claims on Danzig in 1939. At that time Gdynia was built which became a deadly threat to Danzig´s monopolistic position as an expensive bottleneck for Poland´s trade.

One last comment: in 1939 the other cities did not became German but have come under extremely brutal German occupation.

Back to today: 4 euro/hr is not a lot of money, even in Poland and people returning after a stunt in Germany are not considered nouveau riches. There are enough home grown millionaires. That some unfortunate people feel they have no choice but to work in Germany is a sorry fact. Nothing to be proud about. On the other hand - the huge German unemployment is due to the fact that the Chinese&co. are not less productive than Germans and certainly not less smart but many, many times cheaper and less demanding. Who´s to blame? Do you want to close borders and stop the de-industrialisation as well as import (than you´ll have to change cars every 2-3 months to keep industry going). I guess that a lot of jobs still exist in Germany because some Poles have to earn some money and are (still) satisfied with next to nothing/hr.

Let´s get serious, Gents....

[bocian]

Originally Posted by newenstad

Let´s start in the early years. Once there was a man called Julius Caesar. He liked maps. All regions northern the Danube and on the eastern side of the Rhine were called GERMANIA MAGNA at this time. After some years of Germanic tribes who had a rather good life some tribes like the Vistulans, Lendians, Obodrites,... and of course the Polanes founded some small states (~850 ad). The Bohemians became the dukes and then King Otto I. (oh he is King of the Germans and the first Holy Roman Emperor) needed someone to fight against the Slavs from the East. There was a man (his name was Miezko I.) who had married a catholic daughter of a bohamian duke and he was also the leader of "usque Varta fluvium". In the year 966 ad King Otto the Great affirmed the ducal title and this was the start of the "Piast Dynasty".

In the 13th century Poland became diffused in some smalles states and so it was quite easy for the Mongols and some other tribes from "Poland" to raise havoc. But there were some glorious warriors called the "Teutonic Order" and they fought against them and founded their own state. When the whole "Holy European Army" fought in the East the Jews settled down in Poland.
With a little bit help of the Hungarians Przemysl II was crowned in the year 1295 ad as the "King of Poland".
The Teutonics fought against the Polish crown and as a result of many wars the Monastic State of Teutonic Order had been reduced to a small unit and so the Jagiellons had the main power. This was the time of the Poland-Lithunia Kingdom (I think that´s the time of bocian ). Then there were struggles between the Non-Catholic parts and Poland, Russia and Poland, Sweden and Poland,....

In the year 1683 Jan Sobieski fought against the Turks in the "Battle of Vienna" which was the end of the "Islamic Invasion" at that time (everybody knows what I mean). Then it was the time of Prussia, Russia and the Austrian Empire thought that it would be nice to enlarge their empires - thought and done and in 1795 there was no Poland-Lithunia on the European map.

After the Napoleon wars and the Congress of Vienna a new (small) Poland (Congress Poland) was rebuildt but only for nearly 16 years (major power was the Tsar). In 1830 there was the "November Revolution" and Poland lost the limited autonomy in 1831.

Then in 1916 the "Regency Kingdom of Poland" was founded by the Austrian and German emperors to have more people for an army against Russia. On November 11th, 1918 they (Woodrow Wilson and gang) created a state which didn´t exist for more than 123 years and they named their idea Point 13. But there was one city that don´t want to be in the "point 13 land". The name of the town was Danzig and 21 years later more cities became German (all towns till the Pisa-Narew-Bug-San-Line). 1941 all cities were German.

After the WW II Poland was under the occupation of the Soviet Union and when Lech Walesa was elected in December 1990 it was the end of communism in Poland. In 2004 Poland joined the EU.


So what was the thing about the "historic Polish lands"?

LOL, you Tchermans have a great sense of humour after all!

[newenstad]

Originally Posted by bocian

LOL, you Tchermans have a great sense of humour after all!