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[Llywarch Hen]

Originally Posted by Delbáeth

I do like the Lion Rampant though for how it symbolises the struggle of the Catholic Scots rightful claim to the British Throne.
(Side note: I love how Protestants and Unionists love to fly the flag of a Catholic Rebel!)

Dream on! The flag was the banner of a King with the decidedly Germanic name of William, great grandson of the daughter of Prince Eadward of Wessex/England, the husband of an English Princess, and was made even more use of by his son Alexander who also married English! There were no Catholics or Protestants at the time. William the Lion was additionally the Earl of Northumbria, at least for a while, and spent a great deal of effort focussing on this most Anglian of provinces. William's father Henry was also Earl of Northumbria, named after King Henry of England and a grandson of Waltheof, the last English Earl of Bamburgh and Northumbria.

[Delbáeth]

There is no evidence that the flag was adopted as "the Arms of Dominion of Scotland" by William before 1122 when it appeared in the seal of his son Alexander II.

It has however been suggested the Royal Arms of Scotland were first devised by by King Malcom III Canmore in 1061.

I never said that the flag was invented by the Jacobites, I said it was used by the Jacobites. Though, in Scotland is has always been linked with the Catholic Jacobites, hence why you see Lion Rampants up the Gallagate and not Saltires. The Lion Rampant, regardless of its origin, is seen as a Catholic Rebel flag in Scotland.

[Llywarch Hen]

Originally Posted by Delbáeth

There is no evidence that the flag was adopted as "the Arms of Dominion of Scotland" by William before 1122 when it appeared in the seal of his son Alexander II.

William being called 'The Lion' is a big enough hint though.
However, if you restrict it to Alexander II you give it even more Northumbrian and broader English a flavour, given that monarch's connections.

It has however been suggested the Royal Arms of Scotland were first devised by by King Malcom III Canmore in 1061.

Another King fascinated by the English! Here's his wife:

Originally Posted by Wiki

Later tradition often has it that Margaret was responsible for starting the demise of Gaelic culture in the lowlands and Scotland in general. The forenames of Margaret's children were probably intended to bear Margaret's claims to the Anglo-Saxon throne in the period before permanent Norman rule was recognized, and so the first group of children were given Anglo-Saxon royal names. In fact, in Gaeldom, she has usually not been considered a saint, but referred to as Mairead/Maighread nam Mallachd: Accursed Margaret.

Originally Posted by Delbaeth

I never said that the flag was invented by the Jacobites, I said it was used by the Jacobites. Though, in Scotland is has always been linked with the Catholic Jacobites, hence why you see Lion Rampants up the Gallagate and not Saltires. The Lion Rampant, regardless of its origin, is seen as a Catholic Rebel flag in Scotland.

You mocked nonJacobites and Protestants for using it, though they have as much right to it as any other Scot.

[Delbáeth]

Originally Posted by Llywarch Hen

William being called 'The Lion' is a big enough hint though.

However, if you restrict it to Alexander II you give it even more Northumbrian and broader English a flavour, given that monarch's connections.

Another King fascinated by the English! Here's his wife:

What is the point of all of this?

You're obviously just looking for an argument with me. I never denied anything what so ever about the origins of the flag (except the possibility that it wasn't introduced by William). I only stated the perception of the flag and its symbolism in Scotland.

You mocked nonJacobites and Protestants for using it, though they have as much right to it as any other Scot.

I mocked Unionists and Protestants who like to shout and rant about the Catholic people, whilst waving a flag with historical and social connections with the Catholic Jacobites.

[Llywarch Hen]

Originally Posted by Delbáeth

What is the point of all of this?
You're obviously just looking for an argument with me.

Aw, the lickle victim!
I'm just correcting the misrepresentations you make, while trying to lend everything an anti-English tint.

[Delbáeth]

Originally Posted by Llywarch Hen

Aw, the lickle victim!

You would know something about that , wouldn't you?

I'm just correcting the misrepresentations you make,

I never misrepresented a single thing. The flag was the flag of the Jacobite rebellion, and the flag is a popular flag of Catholic Scots in opposistion to the Saltire because of its historical and social connections with Scottish (and Irish) Catholics.

I never said the origins of the flag lay with the Jacobites. You're the one who came along to "correct" something that wasn't wrong in the first place.

while trying to lend everything an anti-English tint.

Just stating facts.

[Llywarch Hen]

Originally Posted by Delbáeth

Just stating facts.

And just putting my personal information out on the net for all the world to see. That's low, and the action [inappropriate language] of a human being. God help any Cause that has people of your moral calibre associated with it.

Thankyou to Staff for editing the relevant details out of his post!

[Monolith]

Could these flags be added please?

Croatian Kingdom (coronation flag)



Republic of Dubrovnik

[M.R.]

Can you replace Carantania flag with this one?



Panther is more visible here. Thanks.

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by Llywarch Hen

That's low, and the action [inappropriate language] of a human being. God help any Cause that has people of your moral calibre associated with it.

Speaking of moral calibres:

Originally Posted by Llywarch Hen

Look, we obviously come at this from completely different worldviews and so on. Not all killing is murder. Abortion is something that has always been done, and always will be.

We obviously come from COMPLETELY different worldviews. No disagreement there.

I won't say what this tells about you as a human being. But I will say that your words to Delbáeth reflect more your character and the moral calibre of the people associated with any cause that is your cause too, and still fall short. I was angered at what he did and it was me who removed the pictures as I saw them. But he is still a 16 year old guy.

What's your excuse, if you have any?

[Llywarch Hen]

Originally Posted by Menydh

I was angered at what he did and it was me who removed the pictures as I saw them.

Ah, Thanks, Mynydd!

But he is still a 16 year old guy.
What's your excuse, if you have any?

That I never behaved like that when I was 16.

[Monolith]

Can this flag be added too? Just for the sake of name

Herceg Bosna

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by Llywarch Hen

That I never behaved like that when I was 16.

If that's an answer, it must be to a question asked by someone else. Not by me.

[Weltschmerz]

Originally Posted by Llywarch Hen

Could we have the Northumberland flag please?

How about it?

[M.R.]

Originally Posted by M.R.

Can you replace Carantania flag with this one?



Panther is more visible here. Thanks.

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