Britain Blasts NATO Members Over Reluctance in Afghanistan

[Aptrgangr]

Britain Blasts NATO Members Over Reluctance in Afghanistan

By ANDREW CHUTER, LONDON

British Parliamentarians have hit out over the continuing failure by some NATO member countries to provide troops for Afghanistan, saying it has undermined the credibility of the alliance and the International Security Assistance Force operations.

A report by the House of Commons defense committee on U.K. operations in Afghanistan released July 18 says it “remains deeply concerned” over the reluctance of some NATO members to provide troops for the mission.

The report also criticized the practice among some NATO countries of deploying troops to the country but placing restrictions on their use — effectively keeping them out of harm’s way.

“Progress has been made in reducing national caveats, but we remain concerned that national caveats risk impairing the effectiveness of the ISAF mission,” the committee said.

James Arbuthnot, the committee chairman, said in a statement that it was clear an international presence will be required in Afghanistan beyond 2009.

“If that commitment is to succeed, its size and strength must be very great, and in our view, considerably greater than the international community is at present willing to acknowledge, let alone to make,” he said.

Defense Secretary Des Browne agreed with the reports criticism of some NATO nations.

“NATO nations should do more to meet the shortfalls in requirements. The U.K. continues to lobby other nations to provide more in terms of military and nonmilitary resources,” he said in a statement.

The British have about 7,700 military personnel deployed in Afghanistan, mainly in the southern province of Helmand, where a fierce fight is underway with Taliban insurgents.
A July 16 report in the Daily Telegraph said the rate at which British front-line troops were being killed or seriously injured is close to passing that suffered during World War II.

“The casualty rate in the most dangerous regions of the country is approaching 10 percent. Senior officers fear it will ultimately pass the 11 percent experienced by British soldiers at the height of the conflict 60 years ago”, the newspaper said.

Ministry of Defence injury rates are officially 3 percent, but when the figures are applied to infantry battalions on the front line, that number increases to almost 10 percent, the media report says.

The defense committee also warned the British government that while it welcomed the additional commitment of helicopters to Afghanistan, U.K. rotorcraft operations were “not sustainable at the present intensity.”
“We recommend that the MoD make even greater efforts to increase the provision of appropriate helicopters to U.K. Forces and sufficient trained air and ground crew,” it said.

Arbuthnot said failure to do more on the helicopter front could undermine the entire British mission in Afghanistan.

“Our service personnel, not least our helicopter air and ground crews, are doing a great job in extremely demanding conditions,” he said. “But they are working to the limit and that cannot go on forever.”

Browne acknowledged that British helicopter forces were working hard and said the situation was being kept under review.

“We have already increased helicopter flying hours in theater and are deploying additional support, in the form of Sea Kings, in the autumn. In the medium term, we are increasing the number of helicopters available, including new Merlins and the conversion of existing Chinooks,” he said.

DefenseNews.com

[alyster]

Well spoken by britons, although it's said over and over again by Americans and Aussies and Britons etc.

Estonians are also in the Helmand province, about 130-140 men. We recently lost 2 men and 2 were injured. [btw. it was on our Victory day]. Anyway which pissed me off was what I saw on DW-TV few days after that. Bundeswher, based in Afganistan safe places, because they have so many restrictions they can't be used in real battles. So these boys were playing war. Every preparation or move they did was well thinked thru, gaurds everywhere, they were talking how risks of getting hit by a bullet is higher at night time and so on. Then next day they backed up their outer camp and drove back to base, with out ever making any contact with enemy. Now we have Britons, Dutch, Aussies, Danes and Estonians dying in Southern Afganistan and these soldats are playing war. That truely pissed me off.

[Strengthandhonour]

The worst part is that nations such as yours and mine rarely get a thank you from the people that started this war.

[alyster]

Well we get out thanks in other ways. US has helped us alot in return. In april, when riots took place in Tallinn and Moscow attacked our embassy and cyber networks, then US' senat and president's administration supported us publicly. Our president managed to host G.W.Bush with G. Rice in Estonia in 2006 and went to visit US this year for 2 days and met with Bush for 2h(1h+lunch) and DM and senat leaders. Very important meetings for us for making ourselves heard and getting US's support for the new cyber defence center planned to build to Estonia. Another similar country is Germany. We haven't had so high level state visits but relations are good and German help was also big in april, specially in the embassy case. So by helping Afgans, we do get our share in return I'd say. We get to be equal allies in NATO who helps and are helped.

I don't want to be a US's toy, but US is currently the only friendly power in the world that can help us if needed. And history has shown we do need to think of security. Even the post cold war era is hard.

But yes, for countries who aren't in a situation like we are in, then it can be pretty hard to understand why they are doing it, because seems like no one cares.

[Aptrgangr]

Originally Posted by alyster

Well spoken by britons, although it's said over and over again by Americans and Aussies and Britons etc.

BS talking by you, the British, US and Australian government. They should withdraw their troops at once instead of pushing others to send even more troops there.
I remind you it was mainly the USA that made the Taliban big and delivered weapons and supplies to them. Now suddenly these freedom fighters that beat back the Sovietunion are considered as terrorists, they are not doing anything different than they did before - and only clowns believe they would be grateful and spare US and Western nations from their Jihad.

Originally Posted by alyster

Estonians are also in the Helmand province, about 130-140 men. We recently lost 2 men and 2 were injured. [btw. it was on our Victory day]. Anyway which pissed me off was what I saw on DW-TV few days after that.

At least 21 German soldiers died in Afghaistan, many victims thanks's to a corrupt regime and the so-called "War on Terror". You should be annoyed your fellow countymen died for a hoax too, instead of demanding more Estonian troops to Afghanistan. Those Muslims carrying out terror attacks and fighting for a Caliphate in Afghanistan and elswhere suddenly are poor immigrants that need our help and understanding as soon as they cross our borders and colonize and terrorize us in our very own homelands. The real terrorists are the Western regimes because they allow this to happen.

Originally Posted by alyster

Bundeswher, based in Afganistan safe places, because they have so many restrictions they can't be used in real battles. So these boys were playing war. Every preparation or move they did was well thinked thru, gaurds everywhere, they were talking how risks of getting hit by a bullet is higher at night time and so on. Then next day they backed up their outer camp and drove back to base, with out ever making any contact with enemy. Now we have Britons, Dutch, Aussies, Danes and Estonians dying in Southern

You moron demand even more Germans to risk their lifes for a criminal and corrupt government? Why don't you go there instead of typing crap? Noone here would miss you and your nonsense. The main enemy of our people is to be found in our parliaments, and not in Afghanistan.
To your information, the Bundeswehr ISAF troops were sent there as reconstruction troops, and not as battle troops, that's why they are not in the direct battle front, but there also have been special forces serving under Enduring Freedom regulations too.

Originally Posted by alyster

Afganistan and these soldats are playing war. That truely pissed me off.

And what do you cretin play?
Instead of being an US whore you should make sure the missions you support serve your country, and Estonian troops in Afghanistan and Iraq do not serve Estonia, those having died already died for nothing but lies and fraud.

[alyster]

I don't have to wonder for long why nationalists aren't taken seriously, it's because of members like YOU! And the way you speak and what you say. I'm not going to lower myself to the level of you.

First of all Taliban was only fraction of Afgan forces which were armed by the Americans. They had all bunch of fighting groups, which weren't united. Taliban was just the one who out played the rest, but later with out any US help in it.

Secondly the war was started by the enemy. If your memory is short than first hit was on 9/11 2001. This hit was directly organized from Afganistan. Moreover next attacks came to Europe: London(several times by now) and Madrid. Had Berlin been hit you wouldn't bee crying here. Taliban's regime in Afganistan was directly supporting organisations carrying out attacks against US and EU. I prefer not to wait when Tallinn gets hit, better destroy the organisations which threaten us.

You are just pissed because your beloved Reich gets bad publicity. Well get used to it. It's not unjustified war like Iraq. Estonians have there about 140 men for our 1.3 million population, while Germany has 3000 men for their 80 million. And imo these 140 men are probably more useful because unlike Bunsdeswher which is there to camp, our men are there to fight. They are not based in Northen Afganistan, where Taliban doesn't and never has had any control of. So that 9 German soldiers died is a real mystery, I just guess there's not much left of the old Prussian army. Lets just face it Germans are cowrds in this case. When it was Berlin blocade or Berlin crises or cold war they begged for US to help, now they spit into their faces. I love European identity, however Americans aren't that different from us. We're both what S.P Huntington calls Western Christendom - western civilization.

With people like Schröder who threatened European security, then we sure have reason to suck up to the US. Damn we're lucky Merkel got the office, although it was a close call.


Edit: BTW Taliban announced that they just executed the second German hostage they took this Wendsday. Lovely freedomfighters huh?

[Aptrgangr]

Originally Posted by alyster

I don't have to wonder for long why nationalists aren't taken seriously, it's because of members like YOU!

Ah, sure, and that's why the state always gives it's best to silence us I presume.

Originally Posted by alyster

And the way you speak and what you say. I'm not going to lower myself to the level of you.

You would not come that high anyway.

Originally Posted by alyster

First of all Taliban was only fraction of Afgan forces which were armed by the Americans. They had all bunch of fighting groups, which weren't united. Taliban was just the one who out played the rest, but later with out any US help in it.

Fact remains those groups having founded the Taliban were aided by USA, despite it was clear Islam does not mention the desruction of communism as goal, but world domination.

Originally Posted by alyster

Secondly the war was started by the enemy. If your memory is short than first hit was on 9/11 2001.

You are even more imbecile than imagined - the next thing you want to tell us is the US led allied troops fight those having carried out attacks on USA resp. Western states, no? If they would, they would find much more to fight against in Saudi-Arabia.

Originally Posted by alyster

This hit was directly organized from Afganistan.

I was not aware the German town of Hamburg now belongs to Afghanistan. At least not yet. I was in the army at that time, in aug. 2001 we had a briefing about the forthcoming attack on the USA, the US authorities just laughed, the Israeli secret service also warned them. Not to mention the imbecile German secret service did not anything to prevent the attack.

Originally Posted by alyster

Moreover next attacks came to Europe: London(several times by now) and Madrid

And what do have Afghan villagers have to do with that? These murderers having been aided by "our" very own governments, those that tell us Islam is the religion of peace and criticizing it is punishable as racism.

Originally Posted by alyster

Had Berlin been hit you wouldn't bee crying here.

Approx.1 German is killed every day by foreigners, approx. 400 women and girls are raped every day, 80% of the rapists are Muslims a feminist activist admitted - I do not need subarctic clowns to tell me what to cry about.

Originally Posted by alyster

Taliban's regime in Afganistan was directly supporting organisations carrying out attacks against US and EU. I prefer not to wait when Tallinn gets hit, better destroy the organisations which threaten us.

The best way to prefent that is to use the army to overthrow the government and to throw the Muslims out again.
It is the infamous and corrupted liberal democracies that bring us down, and not some Mujahedeen elswhere.

Originally Posted by alyster

You are just pissed because your beloved Reich gets bad publicity.

What reputation does your Reich have?

Originally Posted by alyster

Well get used to it. It's not unjustified war like Iraq.

Now, that's hypocritical, again: the main plotters are Arabs from Saudi-Arabia, and neither Afghans nor Iraqis. The Taliban regime never had the logistics to carry out any significant attack here, it were Arabs.

Originally Posted by alyster

Estonians have there about 140 men for our 1.3 million population, while Germany has 3000 men for their 80 million.

That's 3000 men and women too many.

Originally Posted by alyster

And imo these 140 men are probably more useful because unlike Bunsdeswher which is there to camp, our men are there to fight.

The more a reason to bring them home then. If you want to let your people die for a lie, well, strange, I like Estonians and do not wish them harm, but you are welcome if you wish to sacrifice them for nothing...Idiot!

Originally Posted by alyster

They are not based in Northen Afganistan, where Taliban doesn't and never has had any control of.

Do you want to know who is in control not 4km far of my neighbourhood? The "Turkish Power Boyz" - these are way more an annoyance for me, not at least police leaves control to Sharia Sherrifs now.

Originally Posted by alyster

So that 9 German soldiers died is a real mystery,

It were 21 and it is no mystery but a crime.

Originally Posted by alyster

I just guess there's not much left of the old Prussian army.

Since Prussia was liquidated in 1947.

Originally Posted by alyster

Lets just face it Germans are cowrds in this case.

But we have many brave mercenaries form all over the world saving our asses

Originally Posted by alyster

When it was Berlin blocade or Berlin crises or cold war they begged for US to help, now they spit into their faces.

Would the US forces not have purposefully destroyed the civilian infrastructure, food depots, farming machines including farmers, the crisis would not have appeared in the first place.

Originally Posted by alyster

I love European identity, however Americans aren't that different from us. We're both what S.P Huntington calls Western Christendom - western civilization.

How wonderful, tell me more, surely this wonderful civilization's primary threat are some illiterates with machineguns from Hindukush, no?

Originally Posted by alyster

With people like Schröder who threatened European security, then we sure have reason to suck up to the US. Damn we're lucky Merkel got the office, although it was a close call.

Mon dieue, you still do not get the terrorists are Merkel & Co by letting these savages in our lands. There is no "War on Terror". There are terrorists fighting each other, and I do not want my people to die for foreign and criminal causes. Afghanistan is lost anyway, the withdrawal of your heroic forces is a matter of time, the sooner the better.

[Marcus Marulus]

Originally Posted by alyster

We recently lost 2 men and 2 were injured.

"He who liveth by the sword, shall die by the sword."

What were they doing in Afghanistan anyway?

Originally Posted by alyster

and these soldats are playing war. That truely pissed me off.

If the fact that they are only "playing war" pisses you off, then why don't you enrol into the army and go to Afghanistan to fight the real war, instead of spouting nonsense on the internet as a "keyboard warrior?"

[Marcus Marulus]

Originally Posted by alyster

Secondly the war was started by the enemy. If your memory is short than first hit was on 9/11 2001.This hit was directly organized from Afganistan.

Of course, the Taliban organized this whole highly sophisticated attack (9/11) from their wastelands in the Hindukush, with the superior technology they possess. Those Taliban must be some kind of supermen.

Originally Posted by alyster

I prefer not to wait when Tallinn gets hit, better destroy the organisations which threaten us.

I am convinced that the Taliban have the city map of Tallinn on their tables and that they are carefully exporing it and planning terror attacks against Tallinn all day and night.

Originally Posted by alyster

Estonians have there about 140 men for our 1.3 million population, while Germany has 3000 men for their 80 million..

There are also Croatian soldiers in Afghanistan, but, differently from you, I am deeply ashamed and not proud of it.

Originally Posted by alyster

I love European identity, however Americans aren't that different from us. We're both what S.P Huntington calls Western Christendom - western civilization.

No, thanks. I prefer European civilization/Christendom. I don't feel any closeness with the likes of Pat Robertson or other "Christian" (they are in fact Satanists masquerading as "Christians") American televangelicals who religiously approve mass-murders and the conquest of the world in the name of their God-forsaken country (USA) and its "ideals".

Originally Posted by alyster

With people like Schröder who threatened European security, then we sure have reason to suck up to the US. Damn we're lucky Merkel got the office, although it was a close call.

No comment.

[alyster]

Ah, sure, and that's why the state always gives it's best to silence us I presume.

Ofcourse German state gives its best to silence right-wing nationalism, last time these morons took power it ended with the biggest war world has ever seen and the worst genocide in the history of mankind.

You would not come that high anyway.

Lets see.

Originally Posted by Aptrgangr

BS talking by you, and only clowns believe they would be grateful and spare US and Western nations from their Jihad, You moron demand , And what dou you cretin play?

What a genius! Honestly I haven't seen a lower person than you.

despite it was clear Islam does not mention the desruction of communism as goal, but world domination.

Care to give me the passage in Qran for the world domination?

You are even more imbecile than imagined - the next thing you want to tell us is the US led allied troops fight those having carried out attacks on USA resp. Western states, no? If they would, they would find much more to fight against in Saudi-Arabia.

Although Taliban as an ally of Al-Qaeda who let them prepare attacks, which killed thousands of Americans in a single attack, then organised attacks against EU, isn't to be touched. Insted we should attack Saudi-Arabia because Binladen family is vast and some of them have relations with Saudis. Your logic is even more fraud then I guessed earlier. Taliban is just as much responsible for 9/11 and Madrid and London bombings as Al-Qaeda, they must pay, with or with out the help of German cowrds.

I was not aware the German town of Hamburg now belongs to Afghanistan. At least not yet. I was in the army at that time, in aug. 2001 we had a briefing about the forthcoming attack on the USA, the US authorities just laughed, the Israeli secret service also warned them. Not to mention the imbecile German secret service did not anything to prevent the attack.

So Binladen lived in Hamburg? US forces are probably led in Afganistan from Kabul, so you suggest US's main decisions are made in Afganistan?

And what do have Afghan villagers have to do with that? These murderers having been aided by "our" very own governments, those that tell us Islam is the religion of peace and criticizing it is punishable as racism.

Taliban is in the Afgan villages. They control quite a large part of Southern-Afganistan and also have gained ground in Pakistan. Ok, lets follow your logic, let them be and wait, when bomb goes of in Reichstag we'll have a meeting and discuss the situation.

Approx.1 German is killed every day by foreigners, approx. 400 women and girls are raped every day, 80% of the rapists are Muslims a feminist activist admitted - I do not need subarctic clowns to tell me what to cry about.

Get a dictionary, there's a difference between terror and ordinary crime.

The best way to prefent that is to use the army to overthrow the government and to throw the Muslims out again.
It is the infamous and corrupted liberal democracies that bring us down, and not some Mujahedeen elswhere.

Ok, so you suggest negotiations? As long as Binladen promises not to do it again, it's all OK?

What reputation does your Reich have?

Well we've beaten the Reichswher which had Freikorp's help, while batteling Red Army. Then time passed, your Reich with Sovietunion raped our women and murdered our men and killed our jews(judenfrei). Now we're free again. Unlike some we do give our contribution to NATO and joint security.

Now, that's hypocritical, again: the main plotters are Arabs from Saudi-Arabia, and neither Afghans nor Iraqis.

Besides that you are a right-wing nationalist like Hitler(he was way better orator) you also deal with conspiracy theories?

Do you want to know who is in control not 4km far of my neighbourhood? The "Turkish Power Boyz" - these are way more an annoyance for me, not at least police leaves control to Sharia Sherrifs now.

So Bundeswher has to protect Germans from Turks. I wonder why you have the Politzei then? Last I heard it were the Germans opressing the turks and their islamist belifs.

Would the US forces not have purposefully destroyed the civilian infrastructure, food depots, farming machines including farmers, the crisis would not have appeared in the first place.

You honestly want to suggest that Germany alone after the loss in WW2 would have stood against USSR??? Or are you even worse and want to say that nazis and western allies should have made peace and went against USSR together like Rommel suggested? Hadn't it been for Marshall's plan you wouldn't even have the Internet.

How wonderful, tell me more, surely this wonderful civilization's primary thread are some illiterates with machineguns from Hindukush, no?

Sweet and harmless just like kittens,
http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/images/9-11%20%203.jpg

What were they doing in Afghanistan anyway?

Giving medical and military help to Afgans and their government on the request of the government.

If the fact that they are only "playing war" pisses you off, then why don't you enrol into the army and go to Afghanistan to fight the real war, instead of spouting nonsense on the internet as a "keyboard warrior?"

My service starts next year or the year after, depends on the army. Can't enrol for Afganistan before the basic, they don't let me.


Edit: I don't like Iraqi war and I don't like Bush, however some things aren't right here. US, UK and Spain were attacked, NATO code 5 was enforced, but now we can't beat some talibs who don't have planes nor ships or most things we consider natural for an army. Even an uniform. NATO won the cold war on the bases of joint security, however now when it's for the first time actually tested, it fails. With out federal EU, European security is just a bubel if it wasn't for the Americans. That's something to be ashamed of.

[Marcus Marulus]

Originally Posted by alyster

Sweet and harmless just like kittens,
http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/images/9-11%20%203.jpg

So these Taliban are supermen, after all. I am glad you let me know.