Holocaust denier: 'No need to show remorse'

[Frederick]

He might not be a hero but he can certainly be called a great man and I can see why many nationalists respect him. He truly is a credit to his profession. Imprisoning people for holocaust denial is unjust! Freedom of speech and freedom of opinion are rights all peoples deserve yet this law restricts that right. This however did not stop David Irving who has studied and published the events of World War II in a way he sees fit and when in court facing imprisonment he stood by his beliefs and writings! He stood up to injustice and refused to buckle under the weight of egalitarian hypocrites! (a weight which I might add not many people lift, a weight which needs to be lifted if Europe is to be great again)

[Arthur Gordon Pym]

Speech by David Irving, Budapest, Thursday, March 15, 2007

"I BRING you greetings from all the friends of Hungary in my country England.

From the Hungarians who live in England - and there are many who fled from the communist regime in 1956 - and from all your friends and admirers, and there are many of these too.

There is one ugly truth -- and it is a bitter truth -- which links our two great countries: we now both have prime ministers who lie.

One of them, my own prime minister, Tony Blair, has so far still to confess it.

These are bad times for freedom. Perhaps one day Englishmen like me will be seeking freedom in Hungary!

Because the lights of freedom, -- the right to think what we like, to say what we think, and to print and publish what we say -- are slowly dimming, as the ugly light of enforced socialism is dawning again.

I know what I am saying.

Governments do not like historians, and they like those of us who write Real History even less.

They prefer the kind of writer they can buy with money, or bribe with knighthoods and peerages.

You know that something is foul with your own government, when you see it bringing in two hundred foreign police troops to help it stay in power.

You know then that your government is, in real history, in the hands of a foreign power.

For all the 400 days that Austria held me in solitary confinement in prison in Vienna, since you last saw me here, -- punished for an opinion on history that I had expressed sixteen years before, -- the British government made no protest.

We were once a great world power. Some powerful Hungarians even wanted to have our Lord Rothermere as the next king of Hungary!

A great world power no longer, we have been destroyed by the foreign enemies within.

Jack Straw was Britain's foreign minister when Germany first demanded that I be turned over to them for punishment: he secretly agreed, -- I have seen the documents -- but he could not get his hands on me because I was in freedom in America...and Straw went to the same school as I! Some comrade!

We are now all part of Europe, and one European country can mistreat any other European country's citizens as it pleases. Petöfi Sándor must be turning in his grave.

Several of my good friends, writers like me, are in prison in Germany right now, and have been for years, because of what they wrote and believed to be true: I mention today the names only of Ernst Zündel and Germar Rudolf, the scientist.

What hypocrisy! In today's world, the system of international law that was so painstakingly and carefully created for the Nuremberg trials is now in ruins.

The innocent are held in jail.

The guilty are in the seats of power. The electoral system in the democracies has been twisted and distorted to ensure that the criminals gain office - not ordinary criminals like those who walked the prison yard with me in Vienna, but the mega-criminals in the pay of Big Money and foreign powers.

Will we ever see them in handcuffs? Don't make me laugh!

George W Bush and Tony Blair, the leaders of the USA and Britain, launched a criminal attack on Iraq in 2003, a few months before I spoke on the last occasion at this spot.

Under the rules of Nuremberg, what they did was precisely the same as what Hitler did from 1938 to 1944: they have attacked sovereign countries for their own purposes, and invented the pretext to justify their actions.

The world's newspapers and television stations have shamelessly trotted along beside them, applauding vigorously.

Shall we ever see Blair and Bush hang for their crimes, which have caused the Holocaust in Iraq today?

A Holocaust which has caused the deaths of over 600,000 innocent people, and far more if we include those killed by the sanctions campaign which preceded it

We shall not see them hang; they even deny that this holocaust has occurred!

Bush says he has killed "only 30,000" so far in Iraq, that is his best estimate. He and Blair are the real holocaust deniers, not the historians like me.

Yes, in Washington and London the guilty are in the seats of power.

Can you tell me that it is any different now in Hungary? Are the days of Rakosi, Revai, Gerö and Farkas returning?

You tore the evil out of the heart of your Hungarian flag then. If the evil returns you must tear it out again.

The world will never forget: You cast the first stone in 1956 that led to the end of the Soviet empire of evil.

It is for you, the ordinary people of Hungary, to protect your freedoms, just as you paid for the world's freedom then with your own blood.

Szabadsag! I leave you with this message, written in the spirit of Petöfi Sandor:there is one word that is even more important that freedom, for a country as small as Hungary.

And that is Independence. Függetlenség. Protect your independence first. Otherwise all is lost."

[source]

[ares]

I can understand the views of everyone here. Holocaust denial is a point that enemies can belabour us with. Having said that, these same enemies will belabour us with anything just to keep us down so we might as well defy them.

This is how I see it:

Whether the holocaust really happened or not, in the magnitude as stated by the jews or not, is becoming (has become) irrelevant in my book. The fact that they keep whining about it (even if true, one must say) lowers the sympathy factor drastically, in my view of course.

That and the other fact that no one can question, criticise etc anything to do with the holocaust that goes contrary to their views.

Their chutzpah is unbounded. Their god himself must be rolling his eyes ...

[Arthur Gordon Pym]

He is a fairly good historian, I must say. All of his books are available online for free. He worked on sources extensively. Any student of history interested in the second world war should read his books.

My only reproach to his historical method is his too big reliance on diaries written by some National Socialist hight officials. He appears to be obsessed with diaries, which are hardly reliable sources.

[Carnyx]

Political prisoners often get a hero status.

[meadhbh]

Heres the thing that bothers me the most about Holocaust deniers, they are willing to completly rewrite histiry to their own liking. I'm sure there are plenty of reasons for people wanting to say it never happened. But we have enough proof from both sides of the fence Nazi's and Jews to know that it happened. What is the point of trying to tell people it never did.

[Savorgnan]

Originally Posted by Pagandawn

This will be my last post on this phora. It is not a bad forum.

Since you are not banned or even warned, please stay and defend your views. Don't shy away from the first one who has contradicted you. Like Stenghtandhonour said, it's a discussion forum, not an agreement one.

Originally Posted by Pagandaw

It is just too basic for me. I suspect that I'm a bit older than most of you. I don't have the time to argue things that should be self evident for an European nationalist.

Wich is basic, and basically wrong, is your neo-paganist stance. It's like throwing away the last two millenia of European civilisation. The better part of our history. There were not yet European nations before Christianism. So (neo)paganism equals not European nationalism. If you are anti-Christian ("anti-xtian" on your profile), how can you pretend to be a European nationalist?

[Gladstone]

Hi meadhbh. You might find these threads of some interest.

It Laid the Ground for the War Crimes Tribunals...

Foreign Ministry submits Holocaust education bill to UNESCO

[Almost a Christian]

Originally Posted by meadhbh

Heres the thing that bothers me the most about Holocaust deniers, they are willing to completly rewrite histiry to their own liking. I'm sure there are plenty of reasons for people wanting to say it never happened. But we have enough proof from both sides of the fence Nazi's and Jews to know that it happened. What is the point of trying to tell people it never did.

An unfair assessment (if an understandable one) obscured by the odious crew of white nationalists whom hijack proceedings for obvious motives..

What you never see in the media is that Holocaust revisionism was actually a creation of the far left. Many of the founders of which where principled men, anti-Nazis with decorated careers in saving Jews from persecution. They literally sacrificed their futures simply because they found it odious to partake in the popular surge to revel in the defeat of Germany. The authoritive holocaust revisionists are almost universally non-Nazi or explicitly anti-Nazi.

If I make a sweeping summation, (IMO) revisionists dispute two main details 1. the purpose of the chambers 2. revisionists maintain that the organised plan was to concentrate them in areas in order to resettle them in the post war world. Technically and practically very feasible in the event of victory. No authoritive revisionist maintains that Jews where not singled out and persecuted. No authorative revisionist doesn't emphatically condemn this (as far as I'm aware anyway). So the sweeping statement "the holocaust never happened" is a very obstructive and loaded statement leading to some very wrong conclusions..

I'm not quite sure what to make of Irving. An unsatisfactory blend of sympathy and suspicion I suppose. I can't blame anyone for wanting a bit of peace in their final years.

It's obvious that politics and revisionism should be kept as far as part as possible. Both would benefit immeasurably from this, although, in practice, a lack of resources and the seige mentality means that occasionally they get mixed up.

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by Pagandawn

This will be my last post on this phora. It is not a bad forum.

It is just too basic for me. I suspect that I'm a bit older than most of you. I don't have the time to argue things that should be self evident for an European nationalist.

Speaking of basic and self-evident things.. can you spot the difference between this picture..



... and this other picture?



(the first picture was copied from http://forum.stirpes.net/scandinavia...akan-igen.html )

[ares]

Originally Posted by meadhbh

Heres the thing that bothers me the most about Holocaust deniers, they are willing to completly rewrite histiry to their own liking. I'm sure there are plenty of reasons for people wanting to say it never happened. But we have enough proof from both sides of the fence Nazi's and Jews to know that it happened. What is the point of trying to tell people it never did.

Holocaust denial, revisionism, atrocities, proof and "oy vey!" apart, what is wrong is the fact that no-one is allowed to even question anything related to the 6,000,000. Not even from a purely scholarly and genuine viewpoint.

If anything, "they" should encourage more and more investigations to show the deniers that everything happened as "they" say, and maybe even convert the deniers to believers.

This speaks volumes to me. Why the maniacal and rabid suppression? What is there to hide?

One is allowed to question anything under the sun, ANYTHING, but not this particular piece of dogma. WHY?

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by ares

Holocaust denial, revisionism, atrocities, proof and "oy vey!" apart, what is wrong is the fact that no-one is allowed to even question anything related to the 6,000,000. Not even from a purely scholarly and genuine viewpoint.

It is true that the persecution against anyone daring to question the veracity of the Holocaust story is highly suspicious and it points to a fear in that a different truth might be discovered.

However, it is also truth that you can hardly call "scholar" much (perhaps most) of the material thrown in by Holocaust Revisionists.

[ares]

Originally Posted by Mynydd

It is true that the persecution against anyone daring to question the veracity of the Holocaust story is highly suspicious and it points to a fear in that a different truth might be discovered.

However, it is also truth that you can hardly call "scholar" much (perhaps most) of the material thrown in by Holocaust Revisionists.

Mynydd, my point was that even if the argument is presented in an educated and scholarly manner, by eminent scientists and historians, it is refuted and its proponent destroyed.

[Menydh]

Originally Posted by ares

Mynydd, my point was that even if the argument is presented in an educated and scholarly manner, by eminent scientists and historians, it is refuted and its proponent destroyed.

And I agreed there. But it must also be said that there is little of scholar standards being presented.