Atlanto-Baltic type

[Exeter]

I found a great link with illustrations of types in the Russian school of anthropology.

http://ethology.nsu.ru/sp/olopa/2004/Appendix%203.doc

I have uploaded illustrations of the Europids, Atlanto-Baltic, Central European, Indo-Mediterranean and Balkan-Caucasian types.

The Atlanto-Baltic illustration is rather similar to a Hallstatt Englishman from Coon. The Atlanto-Baltic happen to have the same hairstyle and moustache, but it is not only that, his eyeshape is remarkably similar and the whole facial outline too. I wonder if the illustration is made from that man.


The Atlanto-Baltic type


Central European type


The Indo-Mediterranean type


The Balkan Caucasian type


Hallstatt Nordic from England (Coon)

Does someone know what the Central European type is in other typological systems?

http://dodona.proboards35.com/index....ead=1112860037

[Ross]

The Atlanto-Baltic illustration is rather similar to a Hallstatt Englishman from Coon. The Atlanto-Baltic happen to have the same hairstyle and moustache, but it is not only that, his eyeshape is remarkably similar and the whole facial outline too. I wonder if the illustration is made from that man.

Yes, that's him.

But the A-B race does not include only Nordics. It includes all NW European types.

And the White Sea - Baltic race also includes all (Northern) NE European types (Nordic and Baltic), differentiated from Atlanto-Baltids by Lapponoid and/or Uralid admixture.

Does someone know what the Central European type is in other typological systems?

The only reliable correlation I'm aware about is C.S. Coon classification of Ryazan Russians as Corded/Med. Ryazan Russians - the Ryazan type - are a sub-type of the Central Eastern European race, differentiated by somewhat lower CI (1-2 points), a bit narrower face (0.5-1 mm) and a bit darker hair pigmentation (~5% on average) in comparison with other Russians. The Ryazan type is also known as the Lower-Oka (Don-Sursk) type.

The picture of the CEE type is ok, you just have to keep in mind that the face of the type is pretty long, resulting in average FI ~ 90. Without the beard he would look like those "Northern Pontics" or even that Valdaic man.

[Exeter]

Originally Posted by Ross

Yes, that's him.

Thankt for confirming that.

But the A-B race does not include only Nordics. It includes all NW European types.

I thought of that. Did they state what it actually included?

And the White Sea - Baltic race also includes all (Northern) NE European types (Nordic and Baltic), differentiated from Atlanto-Baltids by Lapponoid and/or Uralid admixture.

So would the East-Baltid of Nordenstreng fall under White Sea-Baltic?

The only reliable correlation I'm aware about is C.S. Coon classification of Ryazan Russians as Corded/Med.

Should result in something similar to North-Atlantid, but the type seem broader-faced than what I would have expected from Corded/Med. My impression probably has to do with his age, weight and beard.

Coon wrote the following.

"The Great Russians of a special area lying partly in the Tambov, Penza, and Saratov Governments, who form a mesocephalic nucleus in the country half way between Moscow and the mouth of the Volga, have been subjected to a detailed study,106 which shows them to be essentially Nordic. A mean stature of 169 cm., a cephalic index just under 79, and a head length of 192 mm., indicate an initial resemblance to Nordics or brunet Mediterraneans. The auricular height mean of about 130 mm. is greater than that of Scandinavian Nordics, however, as are the bizygomatic of 140 mm. and the bigonial of 109 mm., while the minimum frontal of 105 mm. is more nearly Nordic than the other lateral dimensions. The face height, 125 mm., yields a facial index on the borderline of mesoprosopy and leptoprosopy; the nasal index, about 65, is derived from a mean nose length of 55 mm. and a breadth of nearly 36 mm.

Half of these Great Russians have wavy hair, the other half straight; the head hair is dark brown (Fischer #4-5) in 30 per cent of the series studied, and almost never black; it is medium brown (Fischer #6-10) in about 50 per cent, and light brown in most of the rest. Rufosity is rare, but at the same time most of the blondism falls on the golden side. About 8 per cent have brown eyes, nearly 30 per cent light, and the rest mixed. Thus these tall, mesocephalic Great Russians are brown to dark brown-haired, and essentially mixed to light eyed. Their facial features conform in most cases to a Nordic standard; the nasal profile is straight or wavy in over 65 per cent of the group, convex in 25 per cent, and concave in the 10 per cent that is left."

The picture of the CEE type is ok, you just have to keep in mind that the face of the type is pretty long, resulting in average FI ~ 90. Without the beard he would look like those "Northern Pontics" or even that Valdaic man.

Believe it or not, I actually thought he look like that Valdaic man! So Central European is definitely not an Alpinid. Why is it called that if it is not a type common in Central Europe?

He is actually similar to what Coon called Scandinavian Brünn (the Valle).

[Ross]

Should result in something similar to North-Atlantid, but the type seem broader-faced than what I would have expected from Corded/Med. My impression probably has to do with his age, weight and beard.

Keep in mind you're talking about a composite type. The CEE race (aka Northern Pontic) consists of the Ryazan type + a bit of Baltic/UP:




The Ryazan/Don-Sursk/Lower-Oka type is more distinctly Corded:



(1st row - the Upper-Oka type, 2nd row - the Lower-Oka/Don-Sursk type)

See the difference between the CEE and Ryazan/DS/LO groups? and note Baltid and Med influences in the UO group, which make this type very similar with the average CEE type.

But all these types are in the CEE race, as they are are all (more) purely or pred. Irano-Corded.

I have no doubt that FI of the person in question is ~90 and thus he's average, but he's a bit more robust (still within the variation), somewhere between the non-Ryzan CEE type and the Valdaic type, which is, again, Corded/Baltid (maybe 50/50).

Believe it or not, I actually thought he look like that Valdaic man! So Central European is definitely not an Alpinid. Why is it called that if it is not a type common in Central Europe?

No, Valdaic is not CEE. It's rounder headed, and also lighter in hair pigmentation by 10% (but not lighter in eye pigmentation) and lower faced (having FI 88.5 vs 90.5) than the CEE type. Also, it's more robust.

I suspect the plates you posted come from one of older Bunak works. Well, once again, his example of the CEE type is ok, but just a bit more robust than the average type.

Those plates come after all from a popular book. It's like TRoE. For example, in one of his books Bunak used the Valle Norse to represent the Nordic race.

... and it's natural as there is certain variation within the CEE race: there is certain Baltid, Pontid and Uralid influence.

[Ross]

I thought of that. Did they state what it actually included?

Traits that are characteristic of the Atlanto-Baltic group are widespread over a large expanse of territory. They are present in the population of almost all of Northwest Europe: Finland (Kajava, 1925) Scandinavia (Bryn, 1932; Bryn, Schreiner 1930, Lundborg, Linder, 1926), Scotland, England and Ireland (Fleure, 1923), Iceland (Ribbing, 1921) and the Faerose Islands (Iorgensen, 1902). Deniker (Denkier, 1898) finds similar types in Northern Germany, and in a few areas of France.