[Awar]

Originally Posted by Milesian

What I see here is mostly a way of life which was contemporary with those times. It is wrong to judge past events through modern sensibilities.

Exactly. I don't judge the people from the past, I just don't think such times should repeat themselves.

My sensibility has nothing to do with anything really. To me, it's obvious that ( for example ) the repression of sexuality brought unto these modern times a spread of decadent oversexuality.

Sex was put under 'taboo' in the past, and then it exploded, and for that reason was put on a piedestal by the people. There was no limit as to the level of which it was under-rug-swept in the past, and now, there's no limit to how overbloated its importance became.

That's what I'm talking about. Fine tuning of what is revered, and what is
forbidden/suggested-against. So nothing becomes hidden, and nothing becomes overbloated.

Humans have short lifespans, compared to the long-term causes and effects which apper during the lifespan of a civilization. What we choose today will affect our descendants, just like the choices of our ancestors
affect us today in more ways than we can cope with.

I do not argue that there was some political ambition amongst some of the Popes. The Popes are not personally infalliable, in fact we have had some downright rotten Popes - a fact confirmed by Popes themselves.

But I don't see they acted any worse than the majority of temporal rulers anyway.


Again, it could be said that this is based on the ambitions of some individuals. The Popes of then were Temporal rulers as well and acted as such oft-times

This is the nature of all true rulers. The idea is to put a safety break onto them

Despite the ambitions of some individuals, the teaching has always been the Temporal and Spiritual powers working in concert for the good of all

"Give to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's"

The teachings are always OK, it's the interpretations which screw it all up.
Not only that, but the firmly oligarchic rule which doesn't really give a toss for the teachings, unless it serves their selfish purposes.

Depends if you class them as Christians. I tend to think of that as a situation peculiar to America

It's also a cut-out from Europe's past. They were cut from Europe's soil centuries ago, and pasted onto US soil, where they remained on the same level.

What would you propose?

Would take too long to explain.
Let's just say healthy basis, with tradition as root, and ratio as the future.

Nothing on earth if completely free from corruption, therefore nothing is worthy of being revered?
Also at work is the adage - "Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer"

I encourage you to revere God.

But again, that's working on the belief that the Church stifled knowledge and enlightenment when in fact it was involved in many breakthroughs

While it could have produced many many more, and done much more good than it did. The church should be an institution which hungers for doing good, not just a good act

I don't turn a blind eye. That's why I criticise the current heirarchy.
I simply feel the need to counter claims if I feel they are not fair or are unwarranted

Well, I can only really comment on the Serbian Orthodox church, whose involvement in our history was mostly catastrophic.

Some day, you may be remembered for that astute quote, St AWAR

Thanks St.Milesian. It's comforting to know that my mumified remains will be sold as lucky charms