[Cirrus]

Originally Posted by Youenn

Firstly, to hear you, people will think it's the Breton nationalists who killed this dialect. It's absolutely wrong. This dialect is dead naturally because nobody cares about it.

It's not dead. It's in danger, but as well as the Breton language.

Originally Posted by Youenn

Secondly, the major part (if not all of them) of people who are in Gallo associations are the leftist independentists.

It's also the case with Breton associations, in general.

Originally Posted by Youenn

And finally, in administrative point of view, I don't think there are people who want a centralized Brittany with Roazhon/Rennes or Naoned/Nantes as political center. That should be more federative.

Well, I agree with you here. From what I've heard from nationalists, all of them support the idea of a federative organisation.

Originally Posted by Mynydd

The curious thing here is that the Gallo language is not related to the Breton language. It is a Oïl language and therefore closely related to French.

Originally Posted by svin

What about Lowland and Highland Scots? They speak different languages too. One is Germanic, the other is Celtic.

Svin get a point here : what about Scotland, then ? Should only Highlands get their independence if it happens one day ?
Anyway, I don’t know about Scots, but Gallo is also influenced by Breton in its vocabulary, which differenciate it somewhat from the other Oïl dialects of France.

Originally Posted by Mynydd

So the questions are, why should they go with an independent Brittany?

Independence is an interesting ideal. Maybe more "romantic" than realist. But who knows what will happen in the France of tomorrow in terms of identity and nationalism ?
Anyway, I don't think that it will happen soon (but who knows ?).

But to answer your question, I think that in an independent Brittany, the Gallo dialect would survive. All nationalist movements in Brittany support the idea of teaching Gallo in schools (which is not the case right now).
So, I think the situation would be far better if speaking about linguistics.

Originally Posted by Mynydd

Isn't that a similar case with Breton associations?

Indeed.

Originally Posted by Mynydd

Explain "federative", please. How is it proposed? (if it is proposed)

In general, all independentists (Right or Left) agree that an independent Brittany should not be centralized.
There are 9 traditional "countries" (Pays/Bro) in Brittany. Each of them could have an autonomous authority concerning culture, education and language, for exemple.



Also, Brittany is more diverse than you think. There are several varieties of Gallo dialect, and 5 different dialects of the Breton language.

Originally Posted by Mynydd

You don't even speak Breton, do you? (and I mean more than just a few words and phrases)

I agree with you that this is a problem n°1 with some Breton nationalist movements. But what about some Irish or Scottish nationalists as well ?

Originally Posted by Mynydd

What I would like you to explain is, since you have vowed in favour of a "British identity" but againt a "French identity", how is the British (Anglo-Saxon dominated) identity right but the French (Oïl dominated) wrong?

Most of Bretons I know dislike British imperialism. I don't know about Youenn's opinion, but it is his own opinion, not the one of all Bretons and all Breton nationalists.

Originally Posted by Theobald

Breton nationalists' behaviour during the Second World War is far from being just an "instrument of destabilization". It is an example, among many others but probably the best, of the treacherous, hateful, weak and cowardly nature of your kind, always ready to sleep with the first invader, no matter who or what, because unable to fight by yourselves... English imperialists the day before yesterday, Nazis yesterday, extra-European immigrants today...

Don't be absurd : what about Vichy and the French Collaboration with Germany during the same period, then ?
You speak like one of those people from the "Libre Pensée" (or even like a NeoCon speaking about the "French cowards") who see nazism in everything regional. But they probably don't like your nationalism as well.

About Breton nationalists ar that time, not that I would have support their decisions, but I don't see why people who didn't feel French should be considered as traitors. Don't forget that a big majority of them don't have blood on their hands (at least for those of the PNB), and even that some of those Breton nationalists were Résistants.

Originally Posted by Theobald

The truth is that current, Youenn-like Breton nationalism has no clear basis and is mostly incoherent. If they want to justify the independence of Brittany from an ethno-linguistic point of view, I agree but only the western half of Brittany should be independent. From a historical point of view, Brittany is now French for about 5 centuries, just like many undoubtedly French provinces such as Burgondy or Franche-Comté. From a "popular" point of view, most Bretons (around 75%) want to stay under French rule. From an "ethno-racial" point of view, Bretons (and especially the Eastern ones) share more or less a common Celtic background with their undoubtedly French neighbours (Normandy, Anjou, Touraine, Poitou, ...). So either you leave Eastern Brittany alone, or you accept to remain an united province under French rule. Anything else would be a betrayal to our Gallo brothers.

No offense, but I don't really see the strict coherence in your nationalism as well : is it civic/republican, ethnic or historical ? Please, explain.
If it is the two last, why should you be considered as a French and not as a German ? It would be normal to me, at least.

And last, but not least, even if Eastern Bretons spoke a native Gallo-Romance language, they have always feel and are Breton anyway since it's their historical identity, and that most of them are proud of it. So, they are not your brothers more than me or Youenn.