[Weltschmerz]

Originally Posted by PeterThaGreat

This is something I absolutely relate to and it's been the reason I've alianated from majority of Finnish posters in anthro-forums.




Gere, I am happy you could see through that crap, it's the other side of the coin in their agenda, the other half is emphasizing and exaggarating the Lappid influence among the Swedish.

Oh yes. The presence of Finns in Sweden as a result of migrations that happened around 1600 or later - in fact most of it happened after the end of world war two - is often seen as 'proof' that Lappids were a part of the original make-up of the Swedish nation. In order to understand the situation we need to take facts of history seriously, and not just stare blindly at the recently made DNA research, since those studies - however correct they may be - are just frozen frames in the bigger movie picture that we call history.

The Finnishswedes are of direct Swedish extension, from the Swedish settlers that settled the previously unpopulated coastal areas of the country between 1100-1300, this fact does not change despite some additional German influence. To me Finnishswedish is, if speaking in racial context, a person born to Finnishswedish parents, not to a parent. Those bi-langual persons, born after the latter half of 1950's, after the intermarriages really kicked in, do not qualify.

I think that we can agree that Finnishswedishness is a matter of ancestry as well as of heritage. Someone of largely Swedish and wholly Germanic ancestry and heritage, would to me qualify as a Finlandswede, given that among his ancestors are also presumably some of those Swedish settlers of old in Finland. Would that be a sound definition?

I understand it's a tough bite to absord for Finns to know that every major achievements, whether its military, cultural, scientific is from the hands of the germanic minority. Every important institutition in this country is builded by Finnishswedes. For the international audience, I would like to say my thoughts were not expression of opinion, it was a cold fact which doesn't require much to defend.

However, since this is stirpes forum and we should all be buddies here, I have to say that lack of Finnish participance in making the nation does not probably have anything to do with racial inferiority of Finns but rather the fact that Finns have traditionally inhabitet the rural areas, while the bigger cities, Helsingfors, Åbo, Vasa were once overwhelmingly Swedish. And we all know that nothing is invented by the the countryside hillybillies.

Not just for the sake of Stirpes forum, but even more for the greater European cause which is a purpose of Stirpes, and of which I hope and believe that even the "hillbillies" can be a part, you should treat the Finns and all other Europeans with respect. As a Swede - although both my parents are from the countryside - I have a special empathy with the Finnishswedes, and I think that the evolution of contemporary national consciousness in Finnishswedes is as important as is the corresponding evolution for the Swedes in Sweden - in fact I tend to expect it to be an evolution of a shared consciousness that builds on the past to go into the future.

My impression of modern Finland is that it is based on two groups that are different both regarding ancestry and heritage: On the one hand the Finnishswedes with Germanic ancestry and heritage, and on the other the Finns with Fenno-Ugrian heritage. In the era of democracy I suspect that Finnishswedes have lost some of their traditional privileges, and in any case I am interested in hearing what your thoughts are on that particular issue. My guess is that this change can be harmful to the Finlandswedish identity if it is not dealt with thoroughly.

This goes slightly off-topic, but last week the national Finnish broadcasting telecompany, YLE, aired an interesting document of the city of Helsingfors, it mentioned that the Finnihswedish minority in Nyland is inclusively of Central-Swedish origins, the name Helsingfors was originally just Helsinge which the settlers from Hälsinge, Hälsingland,Sweden had given to their new location. (BTW The residents of Ostrobotnia are and Åland are more derivived from Western Swedish and Norwegians).

This is not at all off topic, rather it is very much on topic. I thank you for that information and look forward to learning more about Finnishswedes. You must also understand that most Europeans have little knowledge about your ethnic group. You can rest assured that you will not be off-topic just for speaking about Finnishswedes. On the contrary, I think that many at Stirpes will be interested in knowing more.